Steve Herschbach

Seems like they would have the margin to "price equalize". I used to sell Honda generators among other things and they shipped to Alaska for free and we sold for the same price as dealers everywhere else. But I saw it first hand on everything there it seemed. When I went to Australia the exchange rate was about even, a dollar for a dollar. But everything in Oz sold for twice as many dollars! So even though the exchange rate was even I lost half my purchasing power. There may be taxes and import duties and such at work that FT can't control. But the numbers you describe are crazy when I see the Discovery 3300 going for $100 here.

Well that's cheap enough, good for them. I would be interested hearing how it goes having done a couple mods myself. White's GMT Rebuild

Maybe GeoJack can sell you his. Then he does not need to buy a coil - you can use what he has as is. He saved you some work taking the coil apart!

Thanks for the report. I have no doubt the GPZ with small coil is the way to go. I'm still just shaking trees trying to get a SDC in a proper housing to fall out and multiple coil options are part of that equation. And your thread is the best place to shake the tree!

An excellent report on the latest version of QED optimized for U.S. conditions found here. Honestly, anyone with a Garrett ATX who does not need it to be waterproof would be wise to take a hard look at the QED. With exchange rates what they are you can get a new QED delivered to the U.S. for about what a used ATX will sell for! The QED weighs half as much, has a five-year warranty with free upgrades if desired during the warranty period (the cost to return to Australia actually nominal for just the control box). The best part is the compatibility with over 100 Minelab type coils on the market. The QED is basically what Garrett could have done but has refused... so ditch your ATX and support those who actually are listening and giving us what we want.

I found out about that pin when doing my ATX strip down and rebuild. Found out about it by breaking it! I pried it apart however so I don't blame Garrett for that. Great circuit but I swore off Garrett myself over their refusal to put the ATX circuit in a light weight affordable dry land housing with a set of regular coils. The ATX did well for me as a water detector, but nobody needs that waterproof housing in the middle of the desert. And the coils as you note are crazy, with a person having to buy a complete new telescoping rod assembly with each and every coil! Can you imagine any other company saying that every time you bought a coil you also needed to get another rod assembly to go with it? So that's two, both you and I done with Garrett. I'll not relent unless they repackage the ATX into something more palatable. It truly irritates the heck out of me at this point to put it nicely. I objected to the ATX being put in the Recon housing right up front in the early development stage, and lobbied for a dry land version ever since. Got some nice pats on the head for awhile about how they were listening and it would happen someday. Yeah, right. I was hoping before I died. It's business malpractice at this point to not have a Garrett LTX on the market, just pissing away the opportunity. Well, too late now, anyone with an ATX should take a hard look at the QED. You can actually get a QED for about what a used ATX will sell for, it weighs half as much, and uses Minelab compatible coils. New QED report from U.S. Nov 2019

Yeah, all detectors do that. The question is Equinox doing it MORE than other detectors. That is how I was reading the original post. Tom said "Compared to every other TID machine I have used the Equinox is an outlier. Rings that should hit in the Nickel range hit in the upper tab range, Medium size bands hit zinc penny where with other machines that would be a lunker Class ring or large heavy high karat gold band." Tom says yes. Noah (FL) says no. Since Tom has provided no more information of settings or ground conditions I will just do some stock air tests and post soon comparing to V3i. White's is sort of a standard as they had a lot to do with determining some of the original target id data way back when.

Sorry I did not acknowledge your post. I was referring to the other "this ring read X posts". Yes, you indicate the readings fall where you would expect as on other machines. I just wanted to back that up as a second opinion. Rings sometime surprise but at the end of the day it's just the typical size and composition equation as applies to other items, helped by that magic hole in the middle. The one thing not all people realize is silver is a much better conductor than gold. The use of gold in electronics leads some to believe otherwise. That's for corrosion resistance, not conductivity. And then the other weird factor is adding silver to pure gold. You would assume adding a higher conductor like silver to gold would increase the conductivity of the resulting alloy. It is just the opposite. Due to the way atoms align pure metal conducts far better than alloys, so when you add silver to pure gold the conductivity drops dramatically. I've got a rare chart someplace that shows it... kind of stunning. Anyway, that way low karat gold reads much lower than high karat gold, white gold the worst. and why natural gold nuggets, not pure and irregular in shape, are the hardest of all, reading so low they will run into the ferrous and ground range readings quite easily. Same with micro jewelry. I'll try and find that chart and post, it's buried someplace on my hard drive. In theory an identical ring made of different alloys will have the low karat alloys reading lowest, higher karat higher, pure gold higher yet, and then silver above that. Then you have the issue of basic size. All things otherwise being equal, larger heavier rings read higher than smaller rings with less mass. That’s where it generally goes nuts. Take the basics I just described above and add endless size variation and you get small silver rings reading lower than large pure gold rings, etc. Roundness itself does matter. In the U.K. I dug a ton of 1 - 10 targets, lead and tiny brass bits mostly. I learned that anything round got a substantial boost in target id reading over a similar oddball shaped item. So much so that stuff reading 1 - 6 was either irregular shaped or very tiny round, like birdshot. Anything even halfway larger and round boosted up above 6, and I finally created a cherry pick mode to eliminate digging the vast amounts of tiny hard to recover non-ferrous prevalent in some areas. I had no worries about missing even a tiny round gold Celtic coin, as even the lowest grade example I could find read 7, with most much higher than that. Some tiny stuff does read surprisingly high at time, especially some small brass items.

Never done it but like you I don't see any reason it can't be done. It is the same rod size, same box mount type. The only thing you would need to do is relocate the trigger switch into the GMT pod as is done on the DFX. I guess the question is if White's will sell you the bare DFX handle part required. As long as it's not too much money, you can proceed and back off at any point if the project seems to be going south.

What about them? Honestly, they are a one trick pony so far. Deus is amazing, not doubt about it. But ORX is just Deus Light, a subset at a lower price. Where is the genuine waterproof beach machine? Their true multifrequency machine? Their PI detector? Love to see them. They are doing great with Deus but unless they break out of that mold they are limited going forward. NokMak is moving aggressively on all fronts. They are committed to true multifrequency next in the Simplex housing and PI in the works also. Not a hint from XP those things are coming, though we should not count them out.

Hi Bill, They have been in night vision a long time and I’m sure it’s big for them. I don’t think there is any shame in acquiring a good outside idea when you see one. Companies do it all the time and would be stupid not to if it gives them a leg up. TDI was acquired by Whites from Eric Foster for example. Carl Moreland was instrumental in the V3i and absolutely brought multifrequency expertise to FT, though I do think you are correct in saying that BBS is a tougher nut to crack than it would appear for an expired patent. And for gosh sake they make the analog CZ and have the original designer on board! Surely a digital CZ is possible. I just don’t see Manta/Impulse as moving the needle. Beach PI is a niche in a niche. The gold prospecting market is huge however, so the Terra version has more promise. The problem for FT is there are just so many ways Minelab can respond with what they already have on the shelf it’s going to be a tough go. The GPZ may weigh a ton and cost a fortune, but no prospector will set it aside for something less powerful. They need something to counter Equinox, no doubt about it. I have faith Carl can do it. The question is whether management has the will to drive that aspect of the company forward or not. The fact they were willing to invest in something as oddball as Manta tells me yes. I think people counting FT out will be surprised still. At least I am hoping so!

Did you ever get a Coiltek aftermarket coil for your SDC? Or just a waste of money now that you are running the X-Coil on your GPZ?

Geez, I gave you a picture and you want more. Right there, a little to the left!

I think even if they did not introduce new cutting edge product, which frankly would surprise me, FT can coast for a very long time. They long since got the engineering covered on the F75 for instance, and no reason it can't sell for $199 or less if need be. Lots of room for price decreases still between now and then. In the meantime they are minting money making these things are low cost and still selling for $500. If they are smart all the work going into the Impulse housing will carry over into other product. The Impulse has a analog knobs face, but no reason that can't be replaced with an LCD face sporting touchpads to run a new waterproof digital based CZ multifrequency model. Most of the investment goes into engineering these new housings, and so if perfected they need to spread out the investment by using the housing for more than just a couple PI models. I apologize for the quick and dirty Fisher CZX....

There is some stiff competition right now in the detector industry. We saw Tesoro go away recently, and I expect more consolidation to come. I also expect First Texas to be a survivor. The electronics industry in large part depends on economy of scale. Yes, you do need to innovate or like Tesoro you eventually die for lack of new product. But manufacturing cost is a big part of the game, especially as regards global competition. And there is no denying now detecting is long past being a U.S. based industry. First Texas has been taking some flak for slow introduction of genuinely new product, relying more of repackaging existing product for some time now. What many may not know however is that they have been investing heavily, and the big investment by far was in a new state of the art manufacturing facility. From http://www.grantcountybeat.com/news/news-releases/25974-first-texas-products-corporation-to-invest-7-2-million-on-new-el-paso-facility "December 2015 EL PASO, Texas - Both the El Paso City Council and County Commissioners Court approved economic development incentives that will spur more than $7.2 million in private investment by First Texas Products Corporation, a leading consumer electronics company with domestic and international reach. Approval for the incentive occurred by the City Council on December 8th and the Commissioners Court did the same on December 14. First Texas, which is currently headquartered in El Paso, will construct a new facility in the Mission Valley (1120 Alza Dr.), resulting in the retention of over 50 jobs which have an average annual salary of $65,331. The new facility will strengthen and expand the company's commitment to manufacturing high quality metal detectors for industrial, security and recreational purposes as well as high performance night vision devices for military and civilian markets. Per the incentive agreements with both the City and the County, First Texas Products Corporation is eligible to receive the following incentives package: City of El Paso: A ten year, 50% real and personal property tax rebate totaling $256,019 A rebate on the City's portion of the sales tax, up to $12,000 Possible waiver of building permit costs, estimated at $21,700 El Paso County: A ten year, 50% real and personal property tax rebate totaling $159,570.65 As part of the incentive agreement, First Texas Products Corporation is expected to begin construction within the next 12 months, with the certificate of occupancy being obtained within the next 24 months." This facility has been completed and is now in operation. And in a stroke of luck, I doubt FT anticipated when that article was written in 2015 that trade wars and tariffs would add an extra bonus to their decision to invest in El Paso. A peek inside the new FT state of the art facility So what does this mean? We already know First Texas makes metal detectors and night vision products. Now they have excess capability to sell. Check out the new FIRST TEXAS PRODUCTS ELECTRONICS MANUFACTURING website at http://ftpcircuits.com/ Take some time to explore that website and think about the capability described there. "First Texas Products Electronics Manufacturing understands the dynamic nature of the electronics marketplace. We offer a full range of PCB manufacturing and assembly services to fit all your printed circuit board capability needs. One-stop printed circuit board manufacturer and quick turn PCB assembly solution. Serving OEM customers for many years in a variety of markets offering PCBA, wire harness, electromechanical assembly, build box and full system integration. We also offer auxiliary services - environment testing, conformal coating, machining, packaging and labeling. One-stop printed circuit board manufacturer and quick turn PCB assembly solution. Offering some of the most advanced PCB technology and convenient services found in the industry: Full Spec PCBs, Small Quantity - Quick Turn PCBs, Custom Spec - Quick Turn PCBs, Highly Specialized Precision PCBs, & Large Scale Production." plus... "International Fulfillment Services - We are process and results driven distribution warehouse having experience with hundreds of companies globally including online marketers. Let us seamlessly be an extension of your company; manage orders and inventory like it was our own. Release your order - we pick/pack and ship using our best shipping rates. Kitting, labeling included. We have been in the procurement business for 25 years. We have the contacts and the pricing history to kit your job at a reasonable cost. Don’t hesitate to inquire about how First Texas Products can help you focus on sales and the development of your business." and finally... "First Texas Products Corporation is a consumer electronics company that manufactures metal detectors for industrial, security, and recreational purposes. The company also manufactures and distributes high performance night vision devices for the military and civilian markets. First Texas Products Corporation began operations in 1999. Today it operates more than 11 separate companies, exports to more than 110 countries and provides 397 jobs of which 254 are in El Paso. First Texas Products Corporation offers its products through retailers and dealers throughout the U.S, Canada, Europe, Latin America, Asia, Middle East, Africa, and Australia." And that my friends is why First Texas is not going anywhere. They can crank out detectors in large volumes at very low cost. How do you think I can see a pile of First Texas detectors, good detectors, at Costco by the pallet load selling for $99.99? Take engineering costs out and basic manufacturing cost is very low for these pod on a stick models. The only area First Texas probably struggles with is the old legacy devices, like the old Fisher CZ models and the Gold Bug 2. Basically hand made compared to the newest models, lower volume, which means higher component costs, and therefore they can only sell for as long as the prices can be kept high enough. With the new competition coming online many of these older models are doomed, it is just a matter of when. And I have to wonder about something like the new Fisher Impulse AQ - does it really fit with the low cost high volume business that is FTs bread and butter? I guess only time will tell. One thing I am very sure of however, is that First Texas will continue to be a player in this industry, probably for longer than I will be around.

The current Time Ranger can be had for $225 so if they keep that model and price the "Pro" higher, like $249 - $299 it might do well. The vast majority of Big Box store buyers have never heard of Nokta/Makro. Over $300 and they lost me for sure. Really nutty right now. Gold Bug Pro models are going for $499 or more, like the Gold Bug DP for $599, but you can find the F19 with 6x10 or 7x11 coil for $449 at some vendors. People are paying more for the less capable Gold Bug Pro not knowing they can get more bang in the F19 for less. I guess that is the FT smoke and mirrors game in a nutshell.

Welcome to the forum Beau! I had a little 16' trailer which while I admit was nice seemed like I was working on it every time I took it out, so sold it this summer. Me and "stuff" don't get along too well and it was kind of a relief to see it go away hooked behind somebody else's truck! I was a spoiler while I had it though after a lifetime of tent and truck camping. Nice website! https://www.carsoncityrv.com/ Do you rent "mini-winnie" type rigs? I'd like to load my wife and miniature wiener dogs up sometime and go on some road trips. Seems rental options around here are limited.

Oh, that would be SO wrong... but you may be right. Way to put a roadblock in the way of all those existing aftermarket coils, and for what purpose really? Just to make this more "amateur" versus their "pro" models with a proper connector? Sure we can make adapters, but let's hope they are not that petty.

GREAT! Be sure and add this thread also for reference. Safe travels!

Yup!

Hi Lori, welcome to the forum. Yes, they are the very same detector, says so right on the box. First Texas owns Bounty Hunter. They also own the Fisher and Teknetics metal detector companies so quite a few models are the same except for the labels. The company name is First Texas, not Texas First. Here is the main company link showing all the brands they make at the bottom. They even make night scopes. https://www.detecting.com/ This is an exceptional deal and why I posted about it. You won't get more metal detector anywhere for $100

I really like the F19 and the G2+ a little more (I like the rod design on the G2+) but frankly I thought they were very overpriced when they came out, over $700 U.S. for what was obviously an enhanced Gold Bug Pro. Fisher was making a killing. At the newer $449 price I have actually been looking at them recently... I really do like the straight forward simplicity of the machine. But now with detectors like the Simplex+... well, even $449 seems too high. A Simplex+ versus F19 or G2+ runoff would be interesting, 12 kHz versus 19 kHz. I don't really need waterproof. Frankly I don't need another detector! But depending on price I may have my first Bounty Hunter ever. Have to have a NEL Snake also to go with it.

Great, it's a F19 - wow! I need to brush up on my Czech. Great find El NINO77, thanks for posting. I can't wait to see the price. I have to bet we will see other new Bounty Hunter versions soon also. Bounty Hunter Time Ranger Pro / Fisher F19 / Teknetics G2+

Does it say anything in their about a backlight.... I'm not seeing it.

Gotta say it's one of the First Bounty Hunter detectors I would not mind owning. Nice looking machine. Bounty Hunter Time Ranger Pro metal detector controls & LCD display Bounty Hunter Time Ranger Pro metal detector Bounty Hunter Time Ranger Pro Data & Reviews