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Well, perhaps there is a machine I am not aware of, but I have yet to find a detector that tracks magnetic sand as well as the Whites GMT and gives an actual number and not just a bar graph, and it does it with a constant readout at the same time of the ground balance number, add to that the Probability of iron readout and you have everything you need for nugget hunting. Experience with those readouts works wonders for finding targets in bad ground for a VLF, and if I recall the 24k did not have the same readouts, So lost much of that unique capability, I had one for a short time and sent it back for that reason. That readout combo with new fast electronics and multi frequency would be a winner today.

I wish something could have been built with the big box Whites TDI platform. For me, that can out hunt a Equinox, Manticore, Legend, etc. But that's a pulse vs vlf situation. IDs in dirt like what I have here are out the window anyways.

As a a past amateur radio operator and electrical engineer I knew where you were coming from with your valid concerns re: impedance matching and standing wave ratios affecting transmitter output - but this XP air coupled "waveguide" hack is a bit of a different beast, so some of the standard antenna and transmission line conventions and thumbrules don't exactly apply because we're at microwave frequencies and transmitting at low powers over short distances.

I think that the MXT pro was the closest to the modern detectors that are on the market today,,, even if unmasking is not among the top.. Spectra V3 needs the correct setting for a certain type of difficult terrain... to work correctly... and it does... but the unmasking of this detector is very average... the problem of Whites ... was that he did not constantly improve his detectors.., and that signed the company down...

Like Andy and UT Dave, most of the places I hunt are plagued by higher iron mineralization. I have owned a Whites DFX, XLT, MXT, M6, MX5, MX7, and V3i. I really liked all of these detectors. However, they were simply the wrong detector for my area unless I was just looking for 5” or shallower targets and only needed some basic non-ferrous target IDs. If I was trying to do anything more advanced like actually hit and accurately ID 6” deep or deeper coin sized targets……..forget it. This plate of mostly high conductor targets including 4 early 1940s wheat pennies and an old .925 silver ring were found during a recent wild target group hunt. So 41 of 51 targets on that plate could have easily been silver coins. I was using the Manticore. I was told by some very experienced detector users who have been long time members of the club here in Denver that there was no point hunting the area of the park that I was planning to hunt since it had been completely cleaned out by some of the best hunters in the club on previous trips to the park in years past. During that time the detectors of choice were Garrett AT series and Whites like the ones I mentioned above along with some people using Deus 1 a bit later. There was actually a fantastic hunter using an MXT right in front of me looking for recent drops. I will say that there were virtually no recent drops aside from the shiny zinc penny in the photo. Everything I recovered with the Manticore was 6” deep at least so I guess the advice I got was true from the perspective that people had pounded that area of the park for sure, but only with detectors that could penetrate the iron mineralization to about 5”.

Duplicate Delete.

I used the M9 a bit the last few days on some ghost town sites in Nevada. It wasn't a detecting trip, per se, so I only used it for a couple of hours a day. I like it though. A breeze to swing. Everywhere I used it was either heavy old iron polluted, or both heavy old iron and heavy modern aluminum. It does not separate as well as the M8. But I didn't expect it to. It separates pretty good though, definitely better than the M11. I was using it in mostly pretty heavy vegetation, too, and didn't find it too noticeably more difficult to maneuver than the M8. No really noticeable coil knock in ATG at 22 sensitivity in the tall grass and sage brush. Panned a small .080 nugget on the trip. Air tested a solid 3-4 at about 4" over the M9. I'm sure that will be a lot less than 4" in typical Nevada placer dirt though. Can't comment too much on depth. Most targets in this area of desert hard pan are shallow. Oh, the sticks... That's something I had on my mind too. I found it less of an issue than the M8. While the M9 snags a few more, it lets them go of them a lot easier lift a quick lift and flip of the coil. Not so much shaking or having to pull a stick with a hand as with the M8. All in all, first blush, I see this coil staying on my machine a lot of the time. As @strick mentioned, it seems like a really good all arounder. - Dave

And tnx for the clarification Chase, most of my radio work with antennas was ar HF, UHF, VHF and some higher using tropo-scatter.

RG-174 is typically used in applications < 1 GHz and RG-179 is typically used in applications up to 2.5 Ghz. Therefore, RG-179 attenuates less per unit length at the Deus ~2.4 Ghz transmitting frequency than RG-174 even though it has a higher 75 ohm characteristuc impedance. This has less to do with the difference in characteristic impedances but more to do with the the coax dimensions the shielding and di-electric materials used in the coax which determines the characteristic impedance as well as other properties such as losses at high transmitting frequencies. Since we are talking short coax lengths, the differences in Ghz signal loss is probably negligible in this specific case. So if RG-174 is working for you, go for it.

Only small tidbit I can offer. Not counting a Radio Shack kit detector as a child (the trouble I got into, for digging up a five gallon roofing tar bucket in the neighbors backyard...), and my Dad's old Fortune Hunter Garrett he let me use a lot as a teenager. The only machine I used and used it for quite a few years was an XLT. And I loved that machine. I borrowed a friends once used Equinox 800 for a weekend (it hasn't been used again since I borrowed it...). Did side by sides for two days. Ordered an 800 the next day on Monday morning. Gave my XLT to an old friend that I used to detect with a lot. Consistently, time after time, every time, found more and better with my 800 than he does with my old XLT. The Manticore only increased the spread. He's moved to Montana now and tells me the XLT just goes nuts in his local dirt. Trouble ground balancing, no depth, VID is whacked. His budget is tight so I strongly recommended a Legend. He has seen me run my Manticore a lot though and thinks that is what he has to have. - Dave

This was true test of my modded 5000 and gold snitch. Our claims are finally free of snow here in Montana USA. And these were found in ground absolutely pounded by 5000, 6000's. In fact there were detector holes surrounding both these nuggets and I know I have personally swung over them with my 6000 and never heard them. The mod is a game changer.

Sold!!!

It's just an air-coupled low attenuation coax waveguide that enables the transmitted signal from the coil to travel up the conductor with minimal losses and to radiate its energy close enough to the remote to overcome the severe attenuation of water vs. air. Therefore, as long as some portion of the waveguide is above the air water interface then the remote will "hear the coil". If everything is submerged, then the closer the radiating tip of the coax to the remote, the better. Since it is "air" coupled that would dominate any impedance effects of a coiled wire, plus it's coiled coax (i.e., shielded), therefore the characteristic impedance of the coax is relatively unaffected by coiling turns and the waveguide should work for any coax with a characteristic impedance of less than 100 ohms. The different lengths simply accommodate the different shaft configurations (i.e., short dive shaft or elongated beach shaft). XP includes the longest length in the standard Deus 2 Kit to cover all the bases. HTH

Thank you DWerk!!! The reason I asked is that I am making my own short antennas. I used rg174 with heat shrink on both ends. Tested it at home then used it in the lake last week and it worked fine. I then made another short one from an extra XP factory antenna (the long one). It too worked fine but didn’t know if the factory cable was a better transmitter than the rg174 which is 50 ohm. I can make four 4.5 ft antennas for about $2 a piece. Thanks again for your input. 🫡

Steve G's locking mount is better than the XP stock mount, but it is still susceptible to occasional forced or nuisance unlatching. Believe me and Patinum when we say the RCDigs mount is not just a detecting addict's impulse buy. I now have a lot more peace of mind knowing that a rougue wave, scoop bump, or a dropped shaft is not going to dislodge the remote into the water with only that thin lanyard keeping my $700 investment from being swept out to sea. It also gives you a few more options for securing the waveguide near the remote.

Hi Doc, curious if you have a target date to start selling it?

RG 179 is 75 ohm, Deus 2 radio link is 2.40 to 2.48 GHz. I see where some are making very tight coils of the coax and sliding it inside the Deus to allow them to extend/compress the length for travel. I am not sure what the total effects of this are as it raises the inductance and impedance of the cable (makes a balun). Since the Deus coil contains the transmitter this would raise the reflected power from the antenna back into the transmitter circuits of the coil. I am not an engineer, just someone who dabbles in radios. But I would believe that there is a reason that Deus has particular antenna wire lengths they sell for the Deus. I am sure that someone much more experienced that me (engineer) will correct my errors and provide better information.. 🥸

But it had to be said! I just figured I was the straw that broke the camel's back. 😁 I always appreciate your insight, Steve whether it's something I want to hear or not. I value your expertise, experience, and knowledge. I'm sure the others feel the same.

I don't know about other places in the world, but in my area where there are high minerals, no whites model I've tried or had in the past could outdo either the Deus or Equinox for depth or separation. And now we have the Manticore and Deus 2 so the performance spread is even further. I've even made the mistake in the recent past where I picked a few whites metal detectors because the price was so good and then quickly decided it was a bad idea when I compared them to the newer stuff. I've owned multiple Eagle Spectrums, XLT's and MXT's. Even had an MX7 & DFX just before they went under. Only model I haven't tried that might come close to a Deus 2 or Manticore competition is a V3i. But I doubt it. I think Whites biggest complaint from people is models like the XLT, DFX and V3i were just too difficult to get setup right. Too many adjustments to play with. By the time they simplified models like the MX Sport and MX7 it was too late. But even then neither could compete with the Equinox. My 2 cents anyway.

I was not responding to you specifically Walt as I have seen this from many posters in various places for quite some time. It’s come roaring back with the Storm rumors. But whatever, I kind of regret posting about it now.

I have thought of that mount, it looks nice. I am liking the little locking mechanism that Steve provides for his setup for now. I may have to get the other mount just because I am a detectorist and that's what we do- buy more accessories!

Nice work Damatman, Have you ever considered the RCDIGS mount? That mount allows you to run the cable up the shaft completely and out through the mount. There is one for Steve's excellent shaft, and the standard XP rig. I've been bashing beaches for a while myself with the 13" and 9" and have had no issues. I like the bone conduction headphones myself, and run the cord behind my head so I don't have any trouble with it at all. 👍

A successful company caters to users who like KISS machines as well as those who like to tweak settings. Sure, Garrett has the user-friendly Ace lineup, but their AT lineup has more advanced settings to tweak and frankly, Minelab's current flagship detector, is not that much more complicated than the AT Max in terms of menus and settings. Granted the Axiom is refreshingly KISS compared to the ML GPX 5000. But, I wouldn't exactly consider the GTI 2500 KISS.

I think you may have missed my point, Steve. I never said a White's Detector would beat one of the current offerings you mentioned. What I said was features used in the XLT have been incorporated into some of the newer machines in the past 5 or 10 years. I agree that they bought Whites to keep their designs away from competitors, especially the counterfeiters. As much as I love them, Garrett will never build anything close to the Nox Series or Legend. A little of White's outdated Tech might get them closer, but they'd still fall short. I've read your posts and know that they tend to hold on to their models for a long time before discontinuing them. Still, it's nice to have a US company to support, should we want to.

Not trying to insist this guy is not legit, but a count out doesn't mean anything unless 1) he is actually finding verified club-seeded targets or 2) if someone is actually observing him recover the targets (if they are "natural" or "seeded" finds). Anyone can show up at a hunt with a finds pouch pre-loaded with silvers or relics. If his technique doesn't seem to match his record of finds success then you gotta wonder. Sorry for the cynicism, I'm jaded and have seen this type of behavior often whether the people are motivated by winning contest prizes or simply bragging rights. It's sad. However, another explanation is if these club hunts are simply using seeded surface targets that are just thrown on the ground but mostly hidden by the ground cover. In that case, swinging above the ground is actually a good technique for quickly recovering targets that would otherwise overload the coil or cause a double beep off the edge.