900 Vs Manticore -help?

[PSPR]

4 hours ago, strick said:

I guess you dont hunt salt water beaches?

It's about a 4 hour drive to the Gulf.  The dog and I rarely venture out more than 50 miles.  

[Cal_Cobra]

8 hours ago, PSPR said:

Oh, I understand what you are saying.  I just don't expect I will be going metal detecting in the dark.  Should I somehow decide to do that, I'll strap on my 44 mag. right next to my pinpointer. 

Problem is that you'll be blinded by the light from the non red LCD screen and the .44 mag will be useless because you can't see 🙂   The F75 has an always on backlit LCD, not adjustable in any way, and it's blinding to hunt at night with it.  I used red gel screen to cover it and it worked pretty well, your eyes could handle the red glow, but the bright white light is blinding.

[Chase Goldman]

16 hours ago, jasong said:

call me a conspiracist or whatever

OK, Jason, you're a conspiracist or whatever.    And you're probably right. 

I respect you taking your principled stand on what is essentially an expensive toy at the end of the day, but standing on that principle means that you probably shouldn't buy any of these recent VLF toys...er...detectors (hard core professional prospecting PI detectors or ultra dive rated detectors are a different matter, of course, and as a pro you know that). 

Of course ML (and Nokta, and XP, and Garrett) is trying to sell us something we don't really need whether it's a Manticore, Nox 900, Go Find, overpriced audio accessories, or craptastic pinpointers.  That's what they all do and it's not a conspiracy, it's their job, and we fall for it every time to the point that we are literally counting pallets in shipping containers and looking for short-lived "in stock" notifications on dealer websites.

Lot's of rationalization and angst on this 900 vs. Manticore issue.   Ok, find your gold coins with the Manticore and call it even.  Bash the 900 red backlight if you must, to feel better about your choice.  Tell yourself that ML can't possibly be releasing a detector that does almost all it's hyped higher-priced cousin can do. I've found gold coins without using the Manticore, 900, 800, or Deus 2.  I don't need any of those detectors.  But I will eventually own them all.  

Here's my rationalization, restated and its no better or worse than anyone else's above:

I'm just happy to have a $600 less expensive incremental tech refresh option and a choice of accessory coils.  Simple as that.  I already have a D2 to do what the 900 can't and supposedly mostly what the Unicort can (and 900 can't) from a features standpoint.  I  am curious to try the Unicort and it's target trace some day.  I can wait.  I also get why folks have no interest in the 900 and desperately want their M-core to show up now.

It's all OK and it really has nothing to do with a step change in performance because that ain't happening any time soon with VLF IB detectors.  The tech has reached a plateau for now with state of the art signal processing, and it's not clear what the next breakthrough will be.  Yes, whether we are talking Legend, Manticore, D2, or Nox 900 - these are ALL incremental upgrades AT BEST wrt to performance vs. the original groundbreaking 2018 Nox.  We are splitting hairs on discussing performance between these models.   So pick your best value proposition with the features you want and be happy and don't be remorseful or begrudge anybody else's choice.  We're all buying into the hype because those who frequent the forum, are by definition, obsessed with the hobby.

Step 1:  ADMIT you have a problem. 

Step 2:  Embrace that and go enjoy your new toy, whatever it may be.  It's called digging therapy. 

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

[PSPR]

11 hours ago, Cal_Cobra said:

Problem is that you'll be blinded by the light from the non red LCD screen and the .44 mag will be useless because you can't see 🙂   The F75 has an always on backlit LCD, not adjustable in any way, and it's blinding to hunt at night with it.  I used red gel screen to cover it and it worked pretty well, your eyes could handle the red glow, but the bright white light is blinding.

Yeah, Cal_Cobra, I'm aware of the military using red lights to save their night vision.  But I don't plan to hunt in the dark anyway and I just don't like that red backlight.  But I don't have to hit what I'm shooting at with the 44 Magnum.  If I just get in the general direction it is going to get knocked down just from the shock wave.  

[Doc Bach]

31 minutes ago, PSPR said:

Yeah, Cal_Cobra, I'm aware of the military using red lights to save their night vision.  But I don't plan to hunt in the dark anyway and I just don't like that red backlight.  But I don't have to hit what I'm shooting at with the 44 Magnum.  If I just get in the general direction it is going to get knocked down just from the shock wave.  

That'll do i carry a Kimber Eclipse Custom 11 10 mm.myself.

[okara gold]

On 12/18/2022 at 3:07 PM, TroyLPN said:

 

Yeah, that red backlight was another thing that I didn't like about it. I hardly ever use the backlight but a pink screen would probably be harder to see.  Why, Minelab? Did somebody on the development team lose a bet or something?

The only thing that comes to my mind being beneficial, would be no white lights during sea turtle hatchings here in Florida, so the red light would be permissible. But I don't think ML had that in the rearview mirror. Or is a red light easier on the eyes?

[phrunt]

The Vanquish has the red back light, it's quite good, I prefer it over the Nox 800 back light at night, in low light at daytime the Nox has the nicer light and the red of the Vanuqish is annoying.  Ideally I'd rather they have a multi colour back light with an option of red.  I guess that might come on the next Nox version, baby steps 🙂

[jasong]

6 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

OK, Jason, you're a conspiracist or whatever.    And you're probably right. 

I respect you taking your principled stand on what is essentially an expensive toy at the end of the day, but standing on that principle means that you probably shouldn't buy any of these recent VLF toys...er...detectors (hard core professional prospecting PI detectors or ultra dive rated detectors are a different matter, of course, and as a pro you know that). 

I resemble that remark.

But seriously, for me it's a matter of just wanting to cut down on how much I give Minelab and I try to keep it to one thing that I can really use/concentrate on until its paid off. I've long ago paid off my GPZ's, my 6000 paid off this summer. I feel like I've learned almost everything I can with those two machines and I'm not moving forward much anymore or learning new things. The Axiom is too close in performance to my 6 to purchase otherwise I'd buy one of those instead of the Manicure. I passed on the 800 since I had already bought 2 GPZ's when it was released and was tired of giving them money back then. I really need something new to learn this next season though and stay busy with or detecting turns into a grind eventually.

The trash pits are still as undetected as ever in the goldfields, so timing on this Manticore is good as I do want a VLF and the Deus 2 just doesn't look like as strong prospecting machine at this time. Still, I'm north of $30k on Minelab products, probably be $40k after the next GPZ. So I like to minimize how much money I send their way, as they've already gotten their share of my wages. One VLF for me, no more. I do take a lot of silly principled stands though. I feel like I've paid for that right. 😁

[Chase Goldman]

1 hour ago, jasong said:

the Deus 2 just doesn't look like as strong prospecting machine at this time

True.  I’d wait to see what Gerry and others say about M-core and natural gold and for that small coil to be released down the road.  I agree with Simon that it’s unlikely to have taken a step back from the proven 800/900 in that regard - but no one expected the XP D2 to lag D1 in small gold either, but here we are for now until and unless XP fixes it with a future update.  No harm in skipping the 900 now, it’s not going anywhere, so you can always fall back if M-core does not pan out.  

[longbow62]

I used to have 2 800's. I sold one recently and the 6" coil with it. I still have my original 800. It has never been in the water, and won't be going in the water. I have the 11", and the Coiltek 10"x5" for it. I have a Legend with the stock and the 6" coil. The only reason I would get a 900 is if the 800 died. It's amazed me the battery on my 4 year old 800 is still kicking, but it seems okay even after 4 years of hard use. I just don't see the point of me buying a 900 when the Manticore is almost here.

The point of the Manticore is more features. New audio, and visual/2d screen features, plus enhanced EMI rejection which is super important to me because I'm around houses and power lines more than I'm in the woods or fields. The oldest parts of where I live currently have the worst EMI. So much so I literally can't hunt some of them.

Unless your a water hunter I just don't see the allure of the 900. Enhanced number of target segments I don't quite get. I'm really good at calling coins with my 800, even silver vs. clad calls. I've compared targets with Etrac's and D2's and the 800's 50 segments never held me back. Plus if your using the 900 mainly for relics do 50 more segments really help you? I'm not saying 100 is a bad thing with the 900. I'm saying I don't see it as major selling point with that detector if you already have a 800. Not with me anyway.