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I Saw The 5000 Up Grade Test


Drellim

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On 11/2/2023 at 7:10 AM, Lunk said:

It is strange how the Extra Deep Gold Mode of the GPZ 7000 isn’t given so much as a mention in this thread, given that it is the lowest frequency option and coupled with the 19-inch coil would be the Zed's weapon for large, deep nuggets. ?‍♂️

Yes. Extra Deep is like General, but cuts out a lot of ground noise. Can also work very well in combination with Normal. 

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The GPX boxes are already a massive shield as they are aluminium. There is also aluminium shield on the end caps under the controls. Just have to make sure the paint is scratched off where the aluminium comes in contact with the case around the screw holes. I can't see how adding another layer around the outside would make any difference, especially as most of the EMI we pick up when out in the field is picked up through your coil. I did try one of these control box shields, I put it on and off during the course of a session, and didn't see any difference. Interference would come and go and change as it always does, whether I had it on or off, and a careful manual tune was the best remedy. The immediate and very noticeable change you can do to improve EMI on those bad days is go to a DD coil, or a smaller mono. 

Re modded detectors, I'm all ears (I did certain mods to some older models), and I still love my 4500,  but the only thing it is lacking compared to newer technology machines is ability on reefy/specimen gold. The 4500 and even 5000 are nearly totally invisible to it, even on sizeable pieces. So if someone could add a GPX6000'esque timing into my 4500, I'd be the first to line up, and I'd probably offload my GPZ and 6000. 

Apart from that, the only two mods I would love for my 4500 are:

1. True analog audio, like the GP3500

2. An analog manual tune on the outside - I added one to my GP extreme and it was awesome. 

Some of the claims made re modded detectors have been a little out there over the years, and others would be extremely easy to demonstrate in a simple video, but after many years I'm still waiting. I would like someone to show some clear comparison videos with the following criteria:

1. Modded machine vs another machine untouched (not a modded machine and changing the controls to "standard")

2. Real gold targets, not aluminium cans or such

3. Targets in ground with the coil sweeping across the ground. Nearly every video I've seen of a modded machine showing some level of improvement, they never show it running across the ground. Noise is our enemy. I always have the most success in the field when whatever machine and coil I am using is purring like a kitten. 

4. Use the same exact coil on both machines, and a coil that people are actually swinging out in the real world. 

So many of the videos that are trying to show off a modded detector show the following:

1. Targets sweeping in air, or targets on the ground and coils raised sweeping over the target (basically zero ground response)

2. No reference or even measurements when showing depth

3. In a workshop with lots of emi 

The other thing that would be nice is if a claim is made along the lines of: such and such mod improves the ground balance accuracy - then I need to see something to verify this statement. 

I've got one of Micks battery regulators, and it's really good, and the workmanship is top notch. 

Here's something that I've recently pondered about. During the GP days, I always thought a straight power cable would run better than a curly cord. When Minelab finally made the curly cord nice and heavy duty I went back to curly cords and kind of forgot about the straight cord. What's everyone's experience on this?? 

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31 minutes ago, PhaseTech said:

During the GP days, I always thought a straight power cable would run better than a curly cord.

What is your theory behind this PT?  Less voltage drop over a shorter distance or something?  Although I thought a heavy duty cable would negate that anyway?  But, as we all know, I am very tech limited  ? 

I am getting a short power cable soon for my GP3500 - now I am wondering if it will be straight or curly...?  ?

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1 hour ago, Northeast said:

What is your theory behind this PT?  Less voltage drop over a shorter distance or something?  Although I thought a heavy duty cable would negate that anyway?  But, as we all know, I am very tech limited  ? 

I am getting a short power cable soon for my GP3500 - now I am wondering if it will be straight or curly...?  ?

Just an observation, but I'd go straight cable over curly wherever possible - lighter, neater ?

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9 hours ago, PhaseTech said:

The GPX boxes are already a massive shield as they are aluminium. There is also aluminium shield on the end caps under the controls. Just have to make sure the paint is scratched off where the aluminium comes in contact with the case around the screw holes. I can't see how adding another layer around the outside would make any difference, especially as most of the EMI we pick up when out in the field is picked up through your coil. I did try one of these control box shields, I put it on and off during the course of a session, and didn't see any difference. Interference would come and go and change as it always does, whether I had it on or off, and a careful manual tune was the best remedy. The immediate and very noticeable change you can do to improve EMI on those bad days is go to a DD coil, or a smaller mono. 

The extra shields are very hard to tell if they're working or not, one way I was able to try and see if it was working is putting it on my 5000, running both my 5000 and 4500 detectors at once in the same spot and doing some target tests, just putting the 4500 down leaving it running while using the 5000 on the targets, then swapping the shield over to the 4500, the one with the shield on always appeared to run the most stable, I had to take into account the 5000 is naturally more stable, It may be a placebo or me just hoping, quite possibly and if that's the case it's still a pretty cheap scratch proof cover for the control box ? It appeared the one that had it on was less affected by the other one nearby.

One thing is for sure Minelab screwed up making my 4500, the box was painted right over both ends so the front/rear alloy foil shields did nothing, they were screwed down onto paint so like you've said I had to pop the hood and scratch it all off on both ends.  Crazy they would let product out like that, I guess the people assembling them had no idea about what they were doing, just slapping some parts together.

You might be onto something with the curly cable Nenad, A bit of a no-no in Hi-Fi Audio is running power cables along with the speaker cables sitting next to each other, some go and tidy their cables and cable tie the power cable to the speaker wires ?it can cause a hum and other interference, that's exactly what a GPX does, the detector sends the audio and the power along the same cable, so it's relying heavily on the shielding in the cable, if any.   A common mistake in car audio is people putting dirty great big subwoofers in their boot and running the RCA cables along with the power cable crushed up together along the same path and get a hum and wonder why, some even get the hum go with their accelerating ?

I've never cut a GPX power cable open, it would be interesting to see the shielding between wires.  That's why I liked switching to the aftermarket lithium type batteries using the short straight cables, less chance of issues there and as others have pointed out their detector appears to run quieter with them.  I doubt it's the battery, I think it's the short cable vs a big long sucker of a curly cable.  I've bought a couple of the NF short heavy-duty cables from you and they're really good, again not sure about their internal shielding so perhaps they could be even better.  I should experiment and make my own well shielded cable.

Some light reading, Cabling Affects Electromagnetic Interference in Complex Ways (emisoftware.com)

It's much the same with coil cables, some brands use very different cables than others and people often notice saying this particular coil handles EMI well, perhaps it's not so much just the coil but also the cable used.

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19 minutes ago, phrunt said:

I doubt it's the battery, I think it's the short cable vs a big long sucker of a curly cable. 

In my set up I replaced the stock battery with lithium added a separate amplifier, but kept the cord. Removal of the stock battery had a large impact, because the amplifier in the battery causes a lot of emi. I had the same curly cord for both set ups. The other improvement is the amplifier in the battery insn't great. Using an aftermarket one improves the experience a lot.

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On 11/5/2023 at 6:26 AM, Goldseeker5000 said:

I have gone back to my 5000 as being my primary go to detector as it is getting me bigger gold. Myself along with three others did some tests with the 6000, 7000, 4500, 5000, modded 4000, and modded 5000 bith by detectronic Australia and the 5000 and 4500 got best depth and signal response on 1/2 oz and 3/4 oz nuggets at depth over the 6000, 7000 and modded 4000. I may get my 5000 modded, but am waiting to see how my buddy does with his modded 5000. I am certain my 5000 with 15" Evo, deep in front, Sharp timing deep audio, 12 gain 7 stabilizer is getting me 1.5 g nuggets deeper than my 6000 and the 7000. I hit a 1.58 gram nugget at 16" deep in a tight spot pounded with the 6000 and 7000. When I got the 5000 in there set how I mentioned above I got an unmistakable target signal where the other two were quite with no signal. I then put it in Sensitive extra, fine gold, general as well as tried all the other audio settings and I got no signals at all. I have it on video. And I have pulled two other nice nuggets out of the ground using my settings I mentioned above. I will probably never take it out of deep in front and deep audio. Sharp is the timing of choice that is getting me results. If the ground is shallow then I use Fine Gold but keep all other settings the same. It is getting me results. 

 

 

 

 

 

Fantastic Goldseeker!  I tried using Sharp many times in CA, but it just beeped on too many hot rocks and I spent more time digging those than gold.  How are you getting around the hot rocks or are you?

Brian.

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