GB_Amateur

I don't have much experience with horseshoes as I've only encountered a few. Large targets close to the surface reveal themselves by the longer (not sharp) drawn-out tones, and especially in pinpoint mode. Deep targets get sharper (and quieter) and are thus more difficult to reject as they sound more like desirable small targets. Nails on the other hand -- every old site I've ever been to has those, and typically a lot of them. Square nails in particular seem to be problematic for most everyone, regardless of detector being used. Bent modern (that is, round cross section) nails can also be an issue. Another problem nail is the roofing nail because its head gives a 22-23 signal on the Eqx. Depending upon its orientiation you may not get any iron grunt, and even under best orientation you are going to get both and have to decide if it's a roofing nail or a desirable target very close to a nail. Even modern nails with small heads that aren't bent will sound good if they are oriented very close to vertical. (Try an air test with one oriented parallel to the coil axis = perpendicular to the coil plane.) Iron bias setting, recovery speed setting, and even cross checking in certain single frequency modes will probably help some. IMO you are going to have to put in the hours with the Equinox, listening carefully to the tones and digging a lot of junk targets to tune your brain on what to listen for. Even then you likely never will be 100% sure of the dig / no dig decision in the more difficult situations. The perfect discriminating metal detector doesn't exist. The only detectorists who never dig any nails are either in sites where none exist or are leaving good targets in the ground.

There may have been some misunderstanding of what I posted. I do realize that frequency adjust is a local, not global setting. My point was that in some cases a change in microfrequency (via the noise cancel) can take a mode from extremely noisy to quiet. I've never seen this before in 450+ hours of operating the Eqx 800. Usually it's a small effect, if any. That is, when in a quiet environment it doesn't matter what microfrequency you are in -- they are all quiet. But in a (broad band) noisy environment it also matters little as you can't quiet things down by simply doing a noise cancel. At least you can't with my unit -- I can't speak for others.

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Thanks for the detailed explanation, Steve. I was thinking the length of the rod would also be critical, but apparently not.

First Texas must have heard you when they designed the F75 since you get the choice of nickel-zone tone (high or medium). Letting you choose your own tones as a function of conductivity, something several detectors now allow, is way better, IMO.

I had a new experience a couple days ago that relates to this thread, so rather than to start a new one I'm just tacking it on here. I was in one of my standard parks which is old and has produced, but grudgingly (meaning it's been searched in the past, probably at the height of the silver cleanout era when good quality discrimination detectors Hoovered up the easily recovered silver coins). I was running the Eqx 800 with 12"x15" coil. Near the parking lot (one of the EMI quietest parts of this often noisy park) I did both ground balance and noise cancel. The gain was set at 22 and I was running custom 5-tones, wide open (i.e. Minelab's "all metal"), Iron Bias F2=5, recovery speed = 5. At some point I lowered the gain to 21, then later 20, and still later back up to 21 -- I don't remember the exact gain setting I was using when the following occurred. I was a bit surprised the detector was running so quietly at these gains, particularly with the large coil mounted. Often at this site I have to revert to single frequencies: 10 kHz or 15 kHz being my typical retreat oases. I got an iffy target and recalled that I had a 50 tone set mode in my Profile so switched over there to see if I cound discern more info. The detector went crazy with a pulsing rate of 3 or 4 per second. I looked at the mode icon and it showed Park 1. Hmmm. So then I did an auto noise cancel and it went quiet. (BTW, recovery speed was also set to 5 in the Profile.) Now that is what noise cancel is supposed to do, of course, but in my experience it seldom works so nicely. I like to call noise cancel "frequency tweaking" because that is exactly what it is, at least on single frequency detectors. For example, on the (simple) Tesoro Vaquero there is a central 3 position switch labeled FREQ1, FREQ2, FREQ3. The manual tells you those frequencies: 14.3, 14.5, and 14.7 kHz. I couldn't find the 19 frequency adjustment deltas in the Eqx manual, and maybe with multi-frequency it isn't so simple to report. Pretty sure the source of the EMI determines if you can get a clean silencing (such as I experienced the other day) or not. Narrow band sources (depending upon how narrow) give you a good chance of getting away from the problem by doing a noise cancel. Broad band sources -- not gonna happen by tweaking the frequency, so try something else.

That's a subtlety I didn't appreciate. A majority of the used Fisher 2-box (Gemini family) detectors I see on Ebay are missing the connecting rod. Maybe you can buy one of those parts from First Texas? But making your own seems more complicated than simply drilling a few holes in an aluminum extrusion. Induction balancing is a lot harder than it sounds.

I'm attaching the manual (downloaded from Fisher's site). (Edit: see Steve's link in his response below.) On page 9, bullet point 4. it says: Still holding the GEMINI-3 parallel to the ground, slowly turn the balance knob (with arrow) on the three-piece handle counterclockwise until you get silence (null) and zero meter reading. My question is this: is the knob actually doing an electronic adjustment (such as being attached to a variable resistor or capacitor) or is it just re-aligning / repositioning the transmitter/receiver/attachment rod to optimal location?

I'm not familiar with that phrase. Do you mean if you wait, something better will come along? Although you can't rule out surprises, the IB/VLF gold detecting technology is pretty mature. What is more likely to happen (and it's been happening) is that the prices come down. But it sounds like you are entering prime hunting season in Arizona and waiting costs you all that fun and search time. You asked specifically about the Gold Bug Pro and gave a pretty hard price ceiling. For a new detector, Phrunt has nailed it, IMO -- the F19 (Gold Bug Pro with a few added bells and whistles) with 5"x10" coil and Lesche tool for $450. That even gives you some jack left over for accessory items, like a plastic scoop, snake chaps, a decent pick, etc. For those check out A&B Prospecting: https://www.abprospecting.com/ (main brick-and-mortar store in Mesa but another satelite store in Prescott). I will point out that used detectors on Ebay (and maybe other places such as detecting forum sites and also craigslist) is an option for those on a tight budget. You just might find a Minelab Gold Monster 1000, Minelab Equinox 600, Makro Gold Racer, Nokta Makro Gold Kruzer, or even a White's Goldmaster 24K that fits your budget, if you're lucky. I think most of those companies honor warranty transfer but worth checking out if you go the used route. A lot of times they require proof-of-purchase date and most sellers are extremely lax in providing that, in my experieince. But sounds like time's a wastin'....

That makes sense to a certain extent. However, in my experience (after finding the sweetspot of response) no matter how repeatable I make my coil motion, most of the time (and always with weaker response ==> small, not near surface targets) the TID varies at least one or two values (often many more even for desirable targets), which in 50 tone does deliver variation in pitch. I guess it's difficult to ask for a yes/no, either/or answer when you are painting a multidimensional mental picture. But let me give an example from my 5-tone settings: My highest bin is 24 and above. If you get all your tones (when operating in 50-tones) in this region but with TID's varying lets say 25-->35 does that make your decision to dig different than if it's a consistent 30-31?

Here's a link to the Fisher website current add. Note that it says "Dual Headphone Jacks": http://www.fisherlab.com/hobby/fisher-goldbug-pro-metal-detector.htm

My Fisher Gold Bug Pro only has the 1/4" jack, even though the company literature at the time I bought it (4 years ago) said it comes with both (that is, also the 3.5 mm). I don't know if they originally supplied only the 1/4" and switched to both, vice versa, or just mistakenly only had the single 1/4" on some units going out the door. I wouldn't use it as a fake/not indicator.

Lots of good points are being made by posters on this thread. There's one thing I should make clear as it may have slipped through the cracks of this conversation: you can use one mode or selection of settings for your search and switch to another to add more detail when you get a promising target. I've used 5-tones for the initial search and switched to 50-tones in just this way (but then after dig/not, back to 5-tones for more searching). If I had an Equinox 600 I would be much less likely to use 5-tones. A big plus for me in owning the 800 is that I can choose the tone volumes, tone audio frequencies (pitches), and especially tone breaks from a large spectrum of options (~25 of each). The multiples of 10 ID' per tone break which are the default on the 800 and locked on the 600 (maybe there is an exception for ferrous-to-nonferrous break, tone, volume) don't work well for US coins, especially the (cupro-)nickel 5 cent piece. I'm not trying to talk anyone out of using 50 tones. You guys who take advantage of them (and to great success) are probably better off there. My target audience is for those who repeatedly struggle with them (as I have). You're not confining yourself to the novice division by avoiding 50 tones. I like Chase's analogy to human language. Not everyone has the same propensity for learning a second language. It's a judgement call as to whether to try and continue with your native language alone or add another. (Obviously there are many more considerations, particularly social, for learning a second human language.) It's possible time can be more efficiently spent on other things than trying to master 50 tones. As always, it's nice to have options.

It's taken me a long time to appreciate what Chase says here, even though he's been saying it (repeatedly) for about as long as he's been a member of this site. I missed out on the analog epoch of (quality) metal detectors and it's taken me four years of repeated reminders that digits aren't the be-all, end-all. I will go on one detour, though. Equinox 5-tone mode will give considerable information in tonal qualities. Is it as much as you get in multi-tone? I'm not going to say that because I have no idea, but if you're like me and 50 tones doesn't fit your ear/brain, set the tone breaks in 5-tone to meaningful places and listen to the sweet music. I tend towards dig-it-all (where 'all' excludes iron, and sometimes the low end of the foil zone) so I don't get too concerned with super accurate target ID's. I don't have many bottle caps to deal with since I don't hunt the beaches. I doubt there is a detectorist alive who is good at audible discrimination who hasn't done a lot of dig-it-all detecting. That's what teaches you what tonal qualities are worth digging and which should be ignored. The only detector right now on my radar as a potentially missed opportunity is the White's V3I with all its graphics candy. I love graphs! It's the weight that shied me away, but maybe the balance of the V3i makes up for the extra weight. Anyway, I'm on a detector acquisition 'diet' right now and the longer I wait, not only do the prices of existing detectors drop but so do the choices of new ones. 😉

Thanks for the link and the pics, Mitchel. Glad to see you didn't have to deal with Pepe' Le Pew. While you're at it, get a better dime, too. Regarding the video, I have a couple questions (for anyone here): 1) What detector was Mike Slater using? Sounded to me like an IB/VLF but looked kinda like a Minelab PI. 2) Why the firearm in the Wickenburg area? I've (nugget) hunted three GPAA claims there and plan to go back. Don't remember seeing / hearing of animals that would require that kind of response. Maybe I should reconsider?

Seems to me like making a waterproof connector is the cusp (hardest part) of this project as you describe it. That is, you want to attach a custom coil to the Tejon, and use that same connector for the Lobo. The male connector on the Tejon isn't waterproof, right? So how do you use that on the Lobo and simultaneously make it waterproof? Also, are you thinking about making internal adjustments to the Tejon to be able to use the homemade coil with it??

Well done, Mark! Finding those tiny pieces of jewelry (like the silver piece above left from Jefferson's head) are a lot like finding tiny gold nuggets. On occasion I've had to use the divide-and-conquer recovery method that native gold hunters practice. But I carry two scoops and a gold pan when I coin hunt (and probably look like a pack mule 🙄). I also have been carrying both the Garrett Carrot and White's TRX pinpointers. I start out checking with the Carrot and then switch to the TRX when I get a signal. For coins the TRX is great at giving me a more accurate bearing and a better distance indication which helps prevent damaging the coins while digging. For small, irregular shaped objects out of the hole the side sensitivity of the Carrot often makes locating them quicker than with the TRX. Agree that for the tiniest bits, sometimes the pinpointers just aren't sensitive enough -- that's when I resort to divide-and-conquer.

Rob has the NuggetFinder Sadie Advantage advertised at his site: https://www.robsdetectors.com/nugget-finder-8x6-advantage-mono/ so apparently there is still inventory with some dealers. This isn't to say the new NF Advantage coils aren't better, but they're also heavier and more expensive. (Rob sells those, too.) As always, balance trumps weight, so maybe the Sadie on the GP family is toe-light. On the more reasonably weighted White's TDI/SL and QED PL-2, though, the Sadie is a dream to swing.

I don't know about F44 coil compatibility. The concentric Greek Series coils will not, in general, work on the Gold Bug family of detectors. There have been reports of occasionally those working, though. I tried a Greek Series concentric on my GB-Pro and it worked for a few minutes but not after that.

I think we're again at the mercy (nice way of putting it?) of different manufacturers' usage of the term 'all metal'. Minelab has chosen to mean discriminate mode (and its associated filtering) with all segments open (i.e. no discrimination threshold and no notching). Simplex goes with the industry standard (first one's to the plate) meaning, what Dave Johnson expands here: (http://www.fisherlab.com/hobby/davejohnson/goldprospectingmetaldetectiontechnologies.htm Most VLF prospecting is done in an all-metals mode which may be variously described as "single-filter", "first derivative", "autotune", or by trademarked names.

Just a general question for anyone -- I'm a complete novice at nugget hunting: I see you on your sidebar that you have a GPX 4000. Would that be a better choice in this difficult ground?

That's a mantra, particularly if you're looking for old coins. Relics, on the other hand, everybody dropped (or more likely threw out) those. Coincidentally I was hunting my favorite old school yesterday when a young woman approached and asked if I was the one who posted on Facebook about wanting to detect old properties. I told her "no" and she started to walk away. When I inquired further she said she lived on an old homestead which had old foundations for which she was curious! I told her I liked to hunt those sites and she gave me her address and phone#. Funny how when we go from young men to old men our appreciation for the value of young ladies' phone numbers change.... 😛 Just another example of why I don't shy away from hunting public sites when people are present.

That's a great looking home/homestead. I do hope this winter is one of those we've had lately where the ground doesn't freeze and there are lots of opportunities for you in low wind, 40s+ temps. Chase gave tons of good advice (as always). I can't add much, other than to not be surprised if some of the ground has been reworked at times in the past. Keep an open mind and you'll do fine.

Pinpoint on most detectors is non-motion minimally filtered. That's the maximum sensitivity you can get. Pretty sure that even on the Minelab Equinox which doesn't give you a minimally filtered detecting mode, the pinpoint is just that. The Fisher F75 has three modes (and lots of discrimination processes): discrimination (with processes), motion all-metal, and static all-metal. There is also a toggle switch for going into pinpoint, but I'm pretty sure that is identical to static all-metal. Is the Teknetics T2 configured similarly? (Note that unfortunately the term 'all-metal' has different meanings depending upon manufacturer. Not only are detector manufacturers competitive in their products, but some like to be competitive/contentious when it comes to definition of terms....)

This may be too risky for your intentions, but (similar to X-coil on Minelab GPZ7000) you could cut a female connector off a cable and make an adapter with the other end being a more common connector. Then add the mating part to all your modified and homemade coils. Something like this: control box 4 pin (Delta) male --> cable 4 pin (Delta) female --> common 5 pin male --> [common 5 pin female]. The coil with amputated cable end should have its 4-pin (Delta) female connector replaced with the common 5 pin female. Your homemade coil then needs the same 5 pin female. Another cleaner but slightly more radical solution is to replace the control box 4 pin (Delta) male with a common 5 pin male. Then you don't need the 'middle man' adapter, but you do need to replace the cable end 4 pin (delta) females with common 5 pin females on all your coils.