Minelab Price Increases

[phrunt]

The market sets the price, if people stop buying or if cheaper competitors take the sales away they would react by lowering prices not putting them up, with brands like Nokia with far cheaper pricing along with the Axiom now pushing some competition into the PI gold detectors they really don’t seem concerned at all, quite the contrary.

Many appear to not like the company or their ethics but most including myself like their detectors, in my case I like them a lot 😁

 

[Aureous]

16 minutes ago, phrunt said:

The market sets the price, if people stop buying or if cheaper competitors take the sales away they would react by lowering prices not putting them up, with brands like Nokia with far cheaper pricing along with the Axiom now pushing some competition into the PI gold detectors they really don’t seem concerned at all, quite the contrary.

Many appear to not like the company or their ethics but most including myself like their detectors, in my case I like them a lot 😁

 

Yeah, thats the crunch....and the argument. Currently (and has been for almost 30 years), Minelab have only had to compete with catch-up company's in certain sectors of the marketplace. The High-end prospecting detector market has previously been theirs to exploit almost unchallenged. They also consistently push the envelope with new tech and ideas and force the other company's to catch up. But, this is now ending and the writing is on the wall....and they dont see it. Whilst we (mostly) all use ML gear and get results, we hate being sucked dry with their ridiculous pricing. To replace lost revenue, Minelab/Codans management have been given 2 choices: (1) release the long overdue GPZ replacement and/or other overdue models or (2) Ridiculously increase retail prices. They chose the dumbest of the 2 options. This now allows the opposition to more easily catch up.

[phrunt]

Well, currently they don't dominate the VLF's at all, Garrett I believe has a better gold prospecting VLF with their 24k than the GM1000, it even has a nice concentric coil option which is increasingly rare.   The Equinox I think is a better prospecting unit than the GM1000 and personally can't think of any reason I'd use my GM over my Nox for prospecting.

The Nox has serious competition with the Legend, especially when it comes to pricing and build quality with very similar performance.  The Nox 900 is sort of playing catch up with the Legend adding the build quality the Legend always had to the Nox 800, and also expanding the ID's like the Legend always had but perhaps a little too far on that one with the Nox 900, from what I've seen people prefer the Legend's ID range and again the Legend destroys it for price, granted the Legend's had its issues with dodgy speakers and buggy software, released far too soon.

The Deus 2 seems to give both the Nox (all models) and the Manticore a run for its money while offering a very different platform.

The Manticore isn't really a giant step over the Nox I don't think although I'd much rather it than a Nox 900 and, in a few ways, prefer my 800 over the Manticore.  The CTX is still in a class of its own for people that it suits but that group appears quite small with its dominance being silvers in mild soil by the looks of it, at least that's what I see as its strong point over the Nox series and few people appear to still use one.  The GPZ still can't be beaten for depth and not far off being the best on small gold sensitivity too, and again deeper on almost all sizes of gold right down to quite small and I believe it to be the superior of the prospecting machines, I can understand many wanting it lighter, but with a small coil I find it plenty light enough.  I just don't know what a GPZ 8000 could bring to the table except for perhaps a 7000 on a diet with a more secure chipping method.

The 6000 has reasonable competition with the Axiom, and in the USA the price advantage it has is very compelling however at the moment I would say Minelab dominate the PI detectors significantly, although it does appear a dying market with shrinking customer base and the possibility of Nokta also entering the game at some point and they will be significantly cheaper, that's a given and will shake up the market the way Garrett should have and could have with significantly better pricing.

[Lynk]

1 hour ago, phrunt said:

The market sets the price, if people stop buying or if cheaper competitors take the sales away they would react by lowering prices not putting them up, with brands like Nokia with far cheaper pricing along with the Axiom now pushing some competition into the PI gold detectors they really don’t seem concerned at all, quite the contrary.

Many appear to not like the company or their ethics but most including myself like their detectors, in my case I like them a lot 😁

 

A very true statement - the market (supply/demand) absolutely sets prices and Minelab has been discounting detectors due to high inventory. Raising prices in a market that only has demand after offered incentives is not likely a strategy that will yield results.

Codan's view of this business unit is evolving and seems likely they ultimately want to be a communications focused company.  The detecting segment has matured and they probably want to cash flow it. It wouldn't be surprising to see it in new hands in a few years. 

[Gerry in Idaho]

Oh boy would I love to jump in and serve everyone some stinking humble pie and my 25+ year opinion of how this company has changed.  But the wiser part of me says to bite my togue and let it go or I could be outside looking in.

Wonder if the new Minelab boss who was recently promoted has any great strategies to help turn Minelab around?  Wishing him and Minelab the best of luck, as we (detectorists) really need them around for at least pushing for greater detectors and detecting technologies.

[markinswpa]

On 11/16/2023 at 1:42 AM, phrunt said:

Well, it appears the rumours of price increases for Minelab products are true.

This from Lost Treasures in Australia, a dealer I trust and have bought from before.

"Just to let everyone know that Minelab will have a price increase for all of their detectors and pin pointers coming in to effect on the 1/1/24. So there is no better time than the present to grab a machine before everything goes up next year."

These are obviously Australian dollars.

I'm not quite sure why there are two GPZ's on the list but I assume one comes with the 19" coil.  It's impossible to put up the price of the Pro-Find 35 😛

I see this list and realize how much money I've burnt when I add up all my detectors 🤣

 

They should be offering rebates for the stuff they have been peddling lately.

[VicR]

Have not yet come across a customer who likes a price rise - but when you have inflation running at between 5 and 8 percent for the last 2 years that increase your business running costs you have three options. Accept a lower profit result because of a reduction in margins due to input cost increases (leads to lower share price & increase in financing costs), raise prices (short term adverse effect on demand)  or cut costs (R&D on the chopping block?).

The large price increase in the high end gold machines is interesting - i wonder if they are getting the market ready for a new whiz bang $15k AUD gold machine that does everything you have dreamed of ?

 

[phrunt]

 Or they are trying to recoup some of the losses of profits they expected from the GPX 6000 with poor sales largely due to Africa's collapse along with quality issues, just sit there for a few moments and ponder how much profit they've lost on that detector, how many people have had one or multiple coils replaced from cracking or noise issues and they lasted well over a year before they were resolved in the peak sales period for a new detector when it first comes out, how many have sent 1.5 years' worth of GPX's in for the EMI fix including in countries outside of Australia which is done by 3rd party repair agents that are going to be far higher costs than them doing it themselves, some countries they are just replaced as they have no board level repairs even though they tried damage comtrol by minimising the problem by downplaying it and outright dismissing it for a long time, not to mention the endless flooding of the Equinox models and broken ears along with other faults with it including the shafts that many early adopters including myself had replaced.      They've had "performance is everything" as their slogan for a reason, they focused on that far too much, yes performance is everything but paying customers also demand quality for their 8 to 10 AUD grand detectors.  The GPZ is fine, the GPX failed in this regard.

They have dropped the ball with quality, that's unquestionable and I have yet once seen any shareholder report even mention any of these issues, some shareholders that are just moneybags and do don't practice due diligence are just blind to their woes and have paid the price for that with their massive share price falls, they rode the wave of the success of the Equinox, it's been a junker since.

I really like Minelab detectors, that's a fact, but I struggle to understand their way of running a business.

Inflation in Malaysia, where your Minelab detector is "born", their manufacturing costs are not an issue, shipping costs are greatly improved, maybe the big cats in Australia are taking too much of the pie (see investor reports and judge yourself, they break down wage packages) 🙂 R&D is hard to know, but their profits suggest it's not as big as some may think.

The annual inflation rate in Malaysia slowed to 1.9% in September 2023 from 2% in the previous month, below market forecasts of a 2.2% rise. It was the lowest inflation rate since March 2021, with prices of food rising the least in 19 months (3.9% vs 4.4% in August), while transport prices edged down 01% after being flat in August. Additionally, prices rose softer for both furnishings, household equipment & maintenance (1.5% vs 1.7%) and restaurants & hotels (4.4% vs 4.7%), while housing inflation was steady (at 1.6%). Meantime, prices of clothing & footwear inched up 0.1% after being flat in August, while that of miscellaneous continued to rise (2.5% vs 2.4%). At the same time, communication prices fell further (-3.7% vs -3.7%). Core consumer prices, which exclude volatile items of fresh food and administered cost, increased 2.5% year-on-year, the same pace as in August, the softest rise since May 2022. On a monthly basis, consumer prices edged up 0.1% after a 0.2% gain in August. source: Department of Statistics, Malaysia

[Aureous]

10 hours ago, phrunt said:

Well, currently they don't dominate the VLF's at all, Garrett I believe has a better gold prospecting VLF with their 24k than the GM1000, it even has a nice concentric coil option which is increasingly rare.   The Equinox I think is a better prospecting unit than the GM1000 and personally can't think of any reason I'd use my GM over my Nox for prospecting.

I agree completely....as I said, the 'writing is on the wall' and they don't seem to see it. As Steve said, nothing improves flagging sales better than a new model....and they aint doing it. A new GPZ doesnt have to be wholly new tech to improve performance. It just needs to be lighter, with better coil options, an actual real-world voltage to coil gain control and improved bias coding for big, deep gold and/or small gold. To achieve this with an already proven circuit would be a cheap'ish achievement. Maybe add Geosense as well... The more they dither, the closer Nokta get to the prize. In a way, I hope Nokta does kick the legs out from under Minelab with their new prospecting PI project....its going to be the only way they abandon their ridiculous $10K+ pricing agenda.  Being an Aussie, of course I want Minelab to succeed, but not at the cost of their loyal customers wallets.

[Aureous]

8 hours ago, phrunt said:

I really like Minelab detectors, that's a fact, but I struggle to understand their way of running a business.

Simon, your statement echoes through most of us. Sometimes I shake my head so much I get dizzy 😁