Hunting With The Garrett Apex

[Bob Sickler]

Wait a minute Bill, maybe we should have keep this all a secret! 🙂

[kac]

10 hours ago, phrunt said:

that's incredible, even in our milder soils here the cupro nickel coins are terrible condition even when from the 80's and 90's, yet yours is in great condition, might have the right combination of soils to not react to it or something.

Hopefully the Apex is a taste of things to come with the pending storm forecast.

 

Usually even in bad ground if the area is dryer ie top of hills as an example the copper alloys hold up bit better. Get into low wet lands then they are usaully toast.

[kac]

Toss a Steve G carbon middle and lower shaft and Apex is very well balanced. Not a huge weight difference but the machine feels better swinging than the D2 with 9".

Apex does handle wet salt sand very well. Extremely quiet machine. Hopefully the new machine will add tracking so transitions between wet and dry sand are smooth.

[Bob Sickler]

1 hour ago, kac said:

Toss a Steve G carbon middle and lower shaft and Apex is very well balanced. Not a huge weight difference but the machine feels better swinging than the D2 with 9".

Apex does handle wet salt sand very well. Extremely quiet machine. Hopefully the new machine will add tracking so transitions between wet and dry sand are smooth.

I did exactly that, although I would have preferred a triangular cross-section to the carbon fiber rods to maintain coil alignment to the control housing. Round tends to slip sideways occasionally if the cam-lock loosens. I also replaced the hard rubber grip with an AT-PRO foam grip. I did so because I just prefer a more "flat slant" to the "S" handle and the foam helps dampen the angularity I'm not fully comfortable with. I do prefer infinite length adjustment over preset "button and hole" adjustments.

Weighing my Apex with the Viper coil before and after the mods yielded a 0.2 lb. decrease on my parcel scale... And for someone who does not have a young arm and back anymore, that little weight reduction just made the Apex even better.

I'm not a fan of "coil heavy" detectors, no matter how light they may be. The heaviest searchcoil I ever used was an early Garrett "Co-Axial" on a Deepseeker, but man could that detector get close to chain-link fences and metal poles!... However, the 6 - 9V batteries at the end of the control housing did help with balance on a "U" handle configuration... Move forward to today and put the Ripper 5 x 8" on the Apex and now we're talking "swing all day kinda comfort" and maneuverability. The Ripper coil has decent depth as well. Tough one to beat in cellar hole hunts, but the Viper does surprisingly well overall.

[DIG5050]

On 4/17/2024 at 6:15 PM, kac said:

Way better shape IHP than I usually see here.

Apex gets bit of a bad rap. Maybe because the audio is so short and doesn't have the modulation as many machines they are accustomed to like the ML, XP and even AT series. I have an Apex myself though don't use it nearly as much as my Tesoros I have done incredibly well with it. I have the stock Viper, Raider and Ultimate 9" which really works well on that machine. I noticed slower sweep speeds really helps at least around here where the ground is rich in iron.

For what it is worth My buddy and i did target for target comparisons with Apex and 9" ultimate and XP D2 with 9" for coin shooting. Both were pretty equal. XP did a little better on identifying aluminum trash but probably because I had it in 40khz smf and the Apex did bit better identifying iron targets but again that was at 20khz multi. Depth wise I would say the Apex has a slight edge with that coil but not enough to rush out and buy one.

Reaper coil does ok but emi and mineralization smothers it here so depth gain is not really worth the weight. Iron trash in the fields makes it much more likely to mask out. On sanded beaches however it is very deep so people beach combing might like it.

Suppose it won't hurt but do ya think Garrett could offer an update to add a pro audio mode like the AT Pro had? I had asked Garrett a bunch of times but get the silence treatment. They are really missing the boat on that machine. I know some people like that short blip but considering the Hybrid audio has almost no modulation it makes the machine difficult to hunt for fringe targets in old sites without relying on the screen.

I, too, was hoping for Garrett to release an update to refine the code of the Apex as well.  The core program is good, but could use a little tweaking to make it even better.  Tweaking it would be a great way to increase the value to the current users and lure prospective buyers to consider the Apex.  Simply allowing limited adjustability of the recovery speed, audio enhancements as mentioned in this thread, toggling the backlight on when changing detecting modes etc., would be beneficial to the all users. 

That notwithstanding, I have spent many hours with the Apex in the last 3+ years too, and found  many, many desirable targets with the Apex, some of my best.  As Bob and others mentioned, working slowly around iron infested sites can yield some nice non ferrous targets. With the Apex, one has to spend a little more time working amongst the iron sounds to hear the non ferrous targets. The D2 can locate these  targets a little faster due to the adjustable recovery speed. 

Recently I was at an old homesite where there was plenty of metallic trash in the ground.  I went over the sight with the D2-9”  and was able to recover 5 coins and some relics.  Then, on another afternoon, I went over the same area with the Apex equipped with the Ripper  coil and extracted two more coins, a key lock, and more relics.

In my Ohio soil, I find the D2-9” hits an 8” buried dime sized target better than the Apex with the Raider coil. But, again, the D2 cost 3x as much as the Apex.  Both machines offer great performance and easy-on-the-arm and shoulder swinging for extended periods of time.  

[Bob Sickler]

4 minutes ago, DIG5050 said:

I, too, was hoping for Garrett to release an update to refine the code of the Apex as well.  The core program is good, but could use a little tweaking to make it even better.  Tweaking it would be a great way to increase the value to the current users and lure prospective buyers to consider the Apex.  Simply allowing limited adjustability of the recovery speed, audio enhancements as mentioned in this thread, toggling the backlight on when changing detecting modes etc., would be beneficial to the all users. 

That notwithstanding, I have spent many hours with the Apex in the last 3+ years too, and found  many, many desirable targets with the Apex, some of my best.  As Bob and others mentioned, working slowly around iron infested sites can yield some nice non ferrous targets. With the Apex, one has to spend a little more time working amongst the iron sounds to hear the non ferrous targets. The D2 can locate these  targets a little faster due to the adjustable recovery speed. 

Recently I was at an old homesite where there was plenty of metallic trash in the ground.  I went over the sight with the D2-9”  and was able to recover 5 coins and some relics.  Then, on another afternoon, I went over the same area with the Apex equipped with the Ripper  coil and extracted two more coins, a key lock, and more relics.
 

In my Ohio soil, I find the D2-9” hits an 8” buried dime sized target better than the Apex with the Raider coil. But, again, the D2 cost 3x as much as the Apex.  Both machines offer great performance and easy-on-the-arm and shoulder swinging for extended periods of time.  

I'm still using Win7 SP1 and although Garrett says the update interface can use Win7, I have issues with it. I have to use my wife's Win10 notebook to actually do any updates. One thing I think Garrett could improve is the USB interface on the control housing. I had mine easily slip out during an update accidentally and "brick" the screen! It required a visit to the factory to resolve.

When I owned a D2, I took it back to a lot of sites I worked with the Apex and found little more for a detector costing three times as much. In all fairness, you can never be sure you ever get it all in big areas. I sold the D2 in favor of keeping the Apex and never looked back. There were other things I didn't like about the D2 that made me let go of it.... Long list actually. I once forgot to charge the 11" coil battery and it flat ended my day out. Another example... Before I realized (more like I couldn't believe) the old Minelab Sovereign didn't have a waterproof coil, I dunked it in a cold stream only to have that day end abruptly too. "Little" things like this irritate a guy! 🙂

My soil must be less mineralized than yours because I can hit naturally buried dimes and pennies easily at 8". I think the 8.5 x 11" Raider coil will see more of the ground minerals than the Viper, even when both are 2D configured. I find the Deus 1 and 2 (stock coil and 11") very coil heavy depending on how the rods are extended coupled with the lightweight remote. All detectors, unless counterbalanced, exhibit some nose dive, but the Apex surprisingly has much less. I once contemplated a backup field charger for my D2 coil, but that is just more money to spend after you learn to charge things when you are supposed to! 🙂

[DIG5050]

Yes, the D2 keeps one on their toes regarding charging all of the various components. The really annoying thing regarding my D2 is the MI-6 pin pointer that sometimes refuses to link.  Un-pairing and repairing it seems to help temporarily.  Sometimes I spend more time cycling the MI-6 power trying to get it linked than its use pinpointing the target.  My carrot never has this problem.  Plus, it’s another thing that has to be charged routinely, too.  I keep a spare 9V battery in my car for the carrot, so it can be changed quickly if needed.  
 

Both offer a light weight swing effort, but the Apex has the lead when used with the Ripper coil.  Either way, I like the S-type shaft.  I hadn’t thought of the CF shafts to lighten the Apex swing weight,  Thanks for that suggestion!  🙂

[Bob Sickler]

I think we are all addicted to having the next best detector. For me to love one and dis others is a bit unfair. I don't mean to influence anyone's decision, because another person might not see and feel the same way about a detector. But, I think constructive comparison is good informative talk for forums and free critique for the manufacturers. Everyone has their favorite brand, I'm no different. Right now we are mostly left with the big three... Garrett, Minelab, and XP. We should be all glad we have different manufacturers to choose from and not just one. We used to have a lot more! My only intention here is  to help those who chose the Apex themselves and not make anyone buy one because I like it. I've owned a lot of different detectors over the years and tested even more. I would have loved to settle on just one and had it become my "right arm", but there was always something I didn't like and it shoved me to look further. I have known people early in the hobby that stayed with only one brand and model and learned it well. Well enough to often times outperform the latest gadget detector. It's only because they long-learned how to operate and interpret signals with incredible accuracy. Many years ago, I tutored an older women club member who asked for my help in how to better use her detector. She had an incredible place to hunt, but did poorly her different times out. After she was shown the right way to use it and got more comfortable with her detector (old White's non-motion), she came to the next meeting and plopped down a medium-sized jar of silver coins! I swear I could almost hear jaws hit the table! To be honest, the art of the hunt is a little more than just the detector!

[Bill (S. CA)]

8 hours ago, Bob Sickler said:

Wait a minute Bill, maybe we should have keep this all a secret! 🙂

Too late!  Besides, nobody believes me anyway - HA!

I have never seen another Apex on the West Coast except mine. Fine by me.  It is an exceptional performer on our saltwater beaches.

 

[The Lama]

2 hours ago, Bill (S. CA) said:

Too late!  Besides, nobody believes me anyway - HA!

I have never seen another Apex on the West Coast except mine. Fine by me.  It is an exceptional performer on our saltwater beaches.

 

Yeah i'm north of you i pretty much only use my Apex on saltwater beaches and when i first got it loved how easy the viper coil swings through the water but soon replaced it with a Reaper coil and pretty much gave up using my cz.The improvements i would like to see would be to go to fully proportional audio on an update so only people that wanted it would get it and maybe up the transmit and or receive power ,my thinking is i run sens almost always wide open only having to back off when the black sand gets heavier.