Question About Iron Falsing Identification On The D2, Legend, And Manticore.

[Digalicious]

Hello.

In the following, I'm referring to iron falsing as, "When a detector produces a good nonferrous tone and a good nonferrous ID on a ferrous object". I mention that, because whenever I've talked about iron falsing on other venues, a few people always reply with, "I can identify iron by the iron grunt", to which I reply, "Well then, that's not iron falsing!" 😁

Anyway, I use a Legend and often hunt in iron infested sites. I use a high weighted SMF mode, but most importantly, I lower my iron bias to the point that iron falsing begins to occur. That way, I know I'm getting the best iron unmasking ability that my detector can provide.

The Legend's Ferrocheck identifies and shows the ferrous and nonferrous content of what's under the coil, and it does so regardless of where settings such as tone breaks or discrimination is set. What I've noticed however, is that Ferrocheck often identifies iron falsing better than ID and tones. For example, when I instigate iron falsing, I'll often get a good nonferrous tone and ID on a nail, but Ferrocheck is clearly, and correctly, identifying the nail as ferrous. To me, it's an invaluable feature when hunting in iron.

Now, I'm fairly certain that the Manticore's 2D screen, and the D2's X/Y screen has that same ability to identify iron falsing, but how the heck are those features able to do that, when ID and tone cannot?

[Chase Goldman]

10 minutes ago, Digalicious said:

D2's X/Y screen

Actually on the D2 its the Horseshoe Ferrous/Non Ferrous display which best helps identify ferrous to non-ferrous ratio regardless of ID shown (some do use the X-Y display as well but the Horseshoe is more analagous to the Legend ferrocheck display), plus iron volume plus non-ferrous tone clipping is a pretty good indicator as well.

[Digalicious]

Ah yes Chase, that F/NF display is definitely more analogous to the Legend's Ferrocheck. Thanks for that, because I didn't even know that existed on the D2.

I still don't understand how that type of feature can sometimes identify true iron falsing, better than tone and ID can. It's as though that type of feature is utilizing the raw data, before the processing of tone and ID occurs. Is that why it can be more accurate? Put another way, under the scenario I presented, why doesn't the tone and ID always match what that type of feature shows?

 

[JCR]

Ferrous Check reports the ratio of ferrous/non ferrous. TID is a single determination of the strongest portion of the processed signal. The Nokta audio(not sure about XP or MInelab) is fairly open gated so it does a good job of blending tones to give some details about the overall target character. I too have found the Legend’s Ferrous Check a very useful feature as a guide but not gospel. Near by iron or minerals will show some bars on a good target.

[Digalicious]

4 minutes ago, JCR said:

Ferrous Check reports the ratio of ferrous/non ferrous. TID is a single determination of the strongest portion of the processed signal. 

"Single determination".

That could very well be the answer I was looking for. More specifically, features like Ferrocheck can have better iron identification than something like TID, because such a feature displays more of the dualistic characteristics of the signal.

[kac]

Large iron and flat iron will always produce a signal in the upper range. If the ground is moist you can pick up iron tone off the edge of the coil. Another thing you can do is do a slow pass with coil over the target and the iron will be more evident. XY screen will also show whats going on.

I set my discrimination to 0, I don't use bcap or any other notch filtering, silencer at a minimum and iron will be easier to identify.

[Digalicious]

Hi Kac.

I'm aware of the coil techniques that are used to illicit an iron tone. However, my question relates to the situation in which the iron bias is deliberately set so low, that some iron won't give an iron tone, no matter the coil technique that is utilized.