Small Nuggets Vs Mineralization

[auminesweeper]

In the past we have used VLFs for Nugget hunting and everyone was over the moon with their machines and since the Birth of the PI a lot of people put down VLFs, Which is A Bit unfair Really, 

We have seen all the manufacturers Telling us all how good their machines are and about the Difference with their tracking systems etc etc,

 

In OZ a certain Famous Gold Nugget was found with A Garrett and that was a VLF although the nugget was Huge it was found about a Foot Deep, No Doubt our Machines have moved on Since the 1980s and Now we have different types of Tracking systems,

The Theory of these system is to Balance out the Ground and keep the Detector running Smoother by making the Ground Invisible to the detector, Well If This Is The Case then why when we GB our machines Does the Ground still give us Problems, Like Drag down the VDIs or make Gold Give an Iron Signal or Reduce the Depth of the machine when the Ground balance was supposed to Take Care of that Problem??

 

So If the Ground is still causing problems  It makes me Wonder if I am in fairly hot Ground and I wave my coil Over a 2 ozt Nugget ?  ( I wish ) would I still hear it at about 7 to 8+ inches using My MXT, Or Would My GMT do it better.  I know the 14 kHz will work better and deeper in hot ground, But after reading A Famous prospectors comments I am not sure about which machine would find that 2 ozt Nugget easier.

 

Thanks Guys,, John

 

 

[argyle]

Hi John.

We'll stick to the MXT (you have the All Pro?) and GMT since you own and use them. If you want a heads up on other brands with tracking, or units that will not track out a target, or units that have tracking which really do not track at all, give us a hoy.

The ground changes far too quickly here and with too high a mineralization mix for both the MXT and GMT to operate in tracking, even on a single two foot swing. The tracking on both units is not a well engineered tracking system, period.

The Ground Tracking on both can never be trusted on our fields. Deep whispering of actual signal responses (heck even close to surface good responses on small nuggets) will be tracked out third time passed instantly. At around the same time it takes for us to check non repeatable ground noise or repeatable hot rocks.

Never sight the screen on either, for visual ID or Iron Id, they malfunction on our ground and all deep gold is relegated to Iron, not just by Whites units on hot ground, but by every detector ever made, Minelab coin units do it too even over fluffy dirt if the sig response is just at or slightly above a good detection level depending on settings used.

The good news however, the really good news, is that the manual GGrab on them is spot-on, almost instant, and can be trusted more than your best mate.

If you are running your Gain, Threshold Hieght and SAT speed at the levels that match and don't mess with each other on the hot ground you are on, you can detect quite a distance before re-grabbing again, which is so quick to do on the fly.

Both are extremely underrated units here, and can handle hot ground and be worked extremely well by those that understand them.

While I have a liking for the MXT pro and love my lower freq vlf's and feel the 14kHz is ideal.... I do tend to place the GMT well above it in overall hot ground performance. In fact my SDC has been relegated from two jobs in favour of the GMT.

Your 2oz nugget scenario 8" under could have hundreds of different outcomes between the two units due to ground types. Funny enough coil for coil (10x5 or 14x8) on both machines, I'd favour the GMT even at the higher 50kHz, because I believe the units correlation of settings behave better than the MXT's do.

(You'd be surprised how many GPX's wouldn't even murmer on an 2oz piece at 8" in certain ground) so don't ever get deflated if your Whites cannot.

[Don in SoCal]

John,  I wish to  thank you for your follow-up to Steve's posting on  'VLF concentric or  DD coils'.  I had been infrequently watching  the post and became concerned about the suitability of the older  White's concentric coils to match up with the newer GMT.  Having Steve explain that some machines (ie.T2)  were designed specifically for  DD type coils made me wonder about the White's GMT design. You have put that question to rest and I thank you for your posts. The topic itself, thank you Steve, gave me a much better understanding of the parameters of the VLF system.            Don

[auminesweeper]

Hi John.

We'll stick to the MXT (you have the All Pro?) and GMT since you own and use them. If you want a heads up on other brands with tracking, or units that will not track out a target, or units that have tracking which really do not track at all, give us a hoy.

The ground changes far too quickly here and with too high a mineralization mix for both the MXT and GMT to operate in tracking, even on a single two foot swing. The tracking on both units is not a well engineered tracking system, period.

The Ground Tracking on both can never be trusted on our fields. Deep whispering of actual signal responses (heck even close to surface good responses on small nuggets) will be tracked out third time passed instantly. At around the same time it takes for us to check non repeatable ground noise or repeatable hot rocks.

Never sight the screen on either, for visual ID or Iron Id, they malfunction on our ground and all deep gold is relegated to Iron, not just by Whites units on hot ground, but by every detector ever made, Minelab coin units do it too even over fluffy dirt if the sig response is just at or slightly above a good detection level depending on settings used.

The good news however, the really good news, is that the manual GGrab on them is spot-on, almost instant, and can be trusted more than your best mate.

If you are running your Gain, Threshold Hieght and SAT speed at the levels that match and don't mess with each other on the hot ground you are on, you can detect quite a distance before re-grabbing again, which is so quick to do on the fly.

Both are extremely underrated units here, and can handle hot ground and be worked extremely well by those that understand them.

While I have a liking for the MXT pro and love my lower freq vlf's and feel the 14kHz is ideal.... I do tend to place the GMT well above it in overall hot ground performance. In fact my SDC has been relegated from two jobs in favour of the GMT.

Your 2oz nugget scenario 8" under could have hundreds of different outcomes between the two units due to ground types. Funny enough coil for coil (10x5 or 14x8) on both machines, I'd favour the GMT even at the higher 50kHz, because I believe the units correlation of settings behave better than the MXT's do.

(You'd be surprised how many GPX's wouldn't even murmer on an 2oz piece at 8" in certain ground) so don't ever get deflated if your Whites cannot.

G'day Argyle, A couple of years ago I Took my first MXT Pro back home To Nambour QLD and I did find 3 small nuggets with it, The combined weight of about 3.3 grams and it worked well there, So I thought, but after that I was wondering about if there were any deeper nuggets, And To be honest I have never used the Tracking because I always lock it and use the Grab, But I get so focussed on detecting I do tend to forget to up date the tracking or pay attention as to when I need to update it, So I become the weak link, I have to be on Guard  all the time to make sure this does not happen, 

 

With the MXT I love the Smoother prospect mode compared to the GMT because it sounds harsh / Sharp, On tiny Bits the GMT see's them a lot deeper but once the Targets get up around 0.15+ grams the MXT seems to start catching up using the Standard 10" Coil, So I need the 6X10 to see A Fair comparison,

 

Because I am over here I have never come up against any Ground that is A Problem, Some of it does get quite high but nothing too serious,  Having Tried quite a few other machines the MXT and the GMTs I seem to be at One with,

 

I was always under the impression that the GPX was Bullet Proof when it came to Aussie Soil, So thanks for pointing That out, It just goes to show that there is no perfect detector and the fact is we need many to cover all bases, I have A TDI SL because it has the Target selection switch but I am still looking at the SDC and a GPX 

 

Thanks for Clearing up so many myths, Real World Info is So Hard to Find,

 

John

 

John,  I wish to  thank you for your follow-up to Steve's posting on  'VLF concentric or  DD coils'.  I had been infrequently watching  the post and became concerned about the suitability of the older  White's concentric coils to match up with the newer GMT.  Having Steve explain that some machines (ie.T2)  were designed specifically for  DD type coils made me wonder about the White's GMT design. You have put that question to rest and I thank you for your posts. The topic itself, thank you Steve, gave me a much better understanding of the parameters of the VLF system.            Don

Thank you for your kind words, But it was Steve who Started the Fire, I just Chopped the Wood,

 

He got me thinking about the GB II having a Concentric and although the GMT has all the Extra Bits on it, So what would happen if I put a Concentric on the GMT,   Well the First thing I Noticed was it saw my tiny test piece at 3 X the Distance and the Real surprise was how my Test  Ground Balance went from 79 down to 65, which to me says the Longscan (concentric) has some kind of smoothing effect, Which hopefully means I can use it in hotter ground and still find those Tiny Nuggets, And That would explain why so many folks love the Older Goldmasters, Because it has Made my GMT see bits As small as the GB II, But I have A Meter and Auto Tracking, So I now have A Goldbug Master or A GMT GB II, lol. either way because of those 2 changes were so huge I would urge others to try that combination, Also this set up has the Ability to see the gold that the Shooter Does  maybe smaller?? it means you can cover more ground but not loose sensitivity to Gold that you have to wet your finger in order to pick it up, 

 

I haven't tested the 8X14 concentric yet.

 

Hope this helps,, Good Luck,,, John

[Rick K - First Member]

Glad you are finding that concentric coil useful!

[auminesweeper]

Glad you are finding that concentric coil useful!

Thanks to You Rick and Steve, I now have More Options, I won't Forget That Mate,

Good Luck,, John

[auminesweeper]

John,  I wish to  thank you for your follow-up to Steve's posting on  'VLF concentric or  DD coils'.  I had been infrequently watching  the post and became concerned about the suitability of the older  White's concentric coils to match up with the newer GMT.  Having Steve explain that some machines (ie.T2)  were designed specifically for  DD type coils made me wonder about the White's GMT design. You have put that question to rest and I thank you for your posts. The topic itself, thank you Steve, gave me a much better understanding of the parameters of the VLF system.            Don

A couple of Days Back I noticed that Inside the front cover of the Manual on the Right hand Page If you Look at the Last Paragraph Jimmy S, States There that The GMT Can Use The Older Goldmaster Coils,

And I must admit I am seeing A Huge Target Size Difference, The Last Piece I tested I can not pick up and I had to use pointed Surgical Tweezers to get a hold of it, The Twin D 6X10 can't even See It, Come to think of it Neither can I,,,lol

 

john