Is Garrett About To Release A New Gold Prospecting Pi?

[geof_junk]

I brought a Garrett ADS Deepseeker one of the top detectors for my wife. I was a gold dredger at the time and was not keen on detecting. As females know more than us mortal men, I was converted. Carol was not impressed with the Garrett so I got her a Whites Coinmaster 6000 the ease of use and the discrimination (for coins etc) she was as happy as a girl in a jeweller shop with a credit card. I inherited the Garrett and I recon that it went deeper than the Whites though Carol disagreed. The Garretts was difficult detector for most people but I had confidence in it and found much gold. Back in those days the top detectors cost 4 ounces of gold each (That is 8 oz to get in front with gold). Since then all my upgrade have been with scrap gold, less than a gram nuggets and crappy gold rings. About 4 years after the first detector I brought the first Aust. version of their Whites GoldMaster which I think Jimmy Sierra had a copy later of it. It was a great detector as I did not use the Garretts much after this I gave it to a work mate that was interested in detecting. In the late 1980s before MineLab came out with the early 1990s Pulse Induction detector I made a PI detector from an Electronic Magazine that I up-graded the components and adjustability including a coil that I made with Teflon coated Silver wire.. It would detect deaper than our gold detectors however the speed of the swing was too slow for me and the Audible was of the old Geiger clicking system which was not to my liking. My brother in law got one of the early ML PI detectors I was not impressed on it performance on the size of gold we were getting at the time. Due to it price and the amount of time and gold that I would use it for, was limited I did not buy a ML detector till the GP series was release and I had retired early and  decided to hit West Australia. The gold finds did elevate with the detectors (2 detector at a cost of 8 oz total early 2000s ... 20+ years after the first detector purchased ) and location that suited my detecting style.

The point of this post is way back then USA made Garretts and Whites were the top detectors. They are now combine and have the ability to produce one of the best detector today. Lets hope they have learnt their lesson and get on track, and use the combined Garretts and Whites technology and make an acceptable PI at a non ripoff price for most Hobby Enthusiasts. Well we can only dream.

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[Aureous]

New tech is the only way ANY company will beat Minelab currently. On top of that, ONLY Minelab has the money to afford the massive R&D funds to create such new tech.....thanks to the huge markup over production costs that their products reap. Its a clever cycle.... create high-end products that push boundaries and get results....because they are 'High-end', they charge massive prices to afford the R&D budget to create the next product. 'Incremental Innovation' is the term and ML do it well.

Having said that, would Garrett or Nokta or FTP have that sort of R&D budget? I recall Dave Johnson (FTP etc)  long ago saying  that all US detector manufacturers appear to have a 1% R&D budget mentality. Do ANY of the big USA players (or Nokta for that matter) have the budget to throw US$5M+ at a new detector with new tech? Any of these 'other' players listed on any stock exchange I wonder?????

Given that very large budget discrepancy, I cannot see ANY other company affording (quickly) any ground breaking metal detector technology to threaten Minelab's dominancy  in the professional prospecting detector market. I would love to see that change, with customers receiving REAL, ACTUAL competition and options but with 27 years of total control at the 'top-end' of this market under ML's belt, I cannot see that change anytime soon.

[abenson]

What puzzles me is why Garrett even wants to compete in the PI gold prospecting market. Minelab clearly has the edge and it's doubtful Garrett will bring anything to the table that will trump Minelab.

On the other hand the beach and relic hunting market sure could use a good PI that's light, waterproof, has iron disc, decent depth and wireless headphones. At the moment XP and Nokta/Makro have nothing, It's pretty obvious Fisher can't pull their heads out and it seems Minelab is not interested in those markets. So Garrett give me a good relic/beach PI that can also do some prospecting and I'm all ears.

[tboykin]

Guys you are missing a huge part of Garrett's marketing expertise - MOST POWERFUL does not equal most sensitive. Expect it to take 12 D Cells, they only need to be replaced once per month.

[jasong]

Brutal. Non-zero chance this is a win a "Toyota", receive a "Toy Yoda" type situation then? 

The ATX is pretty sensitive, it gives me hope. @EL NINO77 posted some interesting results using various coils in the lead shot thread here (scroll down about halfway, also page 3). Also of note is the tests appear to be in a somewhat urban area, which gives me hopes it's good with EMI, a notable stumbling block of the 6000.

[phrunt]

The top end is only part of the market, some people not willing to pay the top end prices but still want a pulse machine they can go use a for a prospecting trip once a year or for a few weekends away are a largely untapped market.   At the moment they're most likely to buy a Gold Monster or something along those lines but they'd do better with a Garrett PI based upon an upgraded ATX design.

I don't know why everyone thinks it has to be the best detector ever made or Garrett are wasting their time, why does it have to compete with the GPX 6000 or GPZ 7000 to justify being made?  Yes, a lot of the people here demand the best and clearly can afford to pay for the best, but not everyone can, or wants to. 

What about other markets, how about Africa? What if Garrett can produce a good reliable easy to use PI in a strong housing with very little problems to be used as a tool and treated rough in Africa by the large number of Africans that want to give a shot at prospecting? Do you think every African who wants to look for gold has the means the pay for a high end Minelab? A lot of them lease their machines already and don't own them, many just buying VLF's and often fake VLF's.  They earn a tiny amount of money, we've all seen the stories on it.   If they can tap into markets like that it would be a success for them and for the Africans getting a PI that works over using the VLF.  Maybe they have ambition to tap into other markets.

By the sounds of it the ATX is a pretty good starting point, and it is sensitive to small gold, surely they can tweak it and get it even better and design new coils and housings for it to bring it up to be quite a good unit and if they can get the price right then who knows how it will go, I would think pretty good in the right markets.

I'm sure when Garrett were planning this detector they weren't aiming for the Aussies rusted onto their Minelab's, they would be chasing different markets.

It's a start towards competition, once it gets into the market and if it sells to their target market they'll continue development for the next version and gradually work their way up the ladder.  If everyone just shoots down anyone that tries we are stuck with no competition and status quo putting up with very high priced machines with quality to match the prices they're asking ? If that's how you like it go join the Minelab cheer leading team.

I'm happy to encourage any manufacturer to give it a shot in hope one can succeed and I wish Garrett the best with this project, I might even buy one myself.

[Jonathan Porter]

1 hour ago, phrunt said:

What about other markets, how about Africa?

Africa is all about performance or using something cheap and simple like the GM1000 and everyone getting on a pick and shovel and hand digging everything. In other words these guys are not hobbiest they want as much gold as possible in a VERY competitive environment, to that end the GPZ7000 is selling like crazy over there. The detector is an actual investment that is expected to make them a return in as quick a time as possible as such the VERY best they can afford and depth on large gold is the order of the day.

1 hour ago, phrunt said:

What if Garrett can produce a good reliable easy to use PI in a strong housing with very little problems to be used as a tool and treated rough in Africa by the large number of Africans that want to give a shot at prospecting?

Garrett already do, its the ATX. I seriously doubt the klunky housing would effect them much if it actually performed as well as say a GPX5000. These are all grasping at straws comments that are not thought through. 

To break into the African market it needs to outperform whatever is performing right now which is the GPZ7000 or it needs to be very cheap and also have some performance, but needs to be more sensitive than the GM1000 VLF.

However if they made an ergonomic and light weight reasonably priced PI for the hobbiest market then that would be something that could get some traction, but it has to be as light and nimble as the GPX6000 as that machine really has set the bar for what is achievable weight and ergonomics wise. 

[Norvic]

I was in the process of answering when fortunately JP my Satellite Connection got with it and showed you had replied.

Essentially I was answering as you have but you did it much more eloquently, thank you.

 Garrett lost the plot way back after the A2B, although they attempted with the ergonomic but flimsy no performance gain A3B but Fischer picked that plot up with the ergonomic performing GB2 as did Whites with the GM2 and since ML has lead the world with its VLFs, Pis and ZVT. Something new Garrett or you`ll just repeat you old mistakes and not compete at all, except with second hand MLs.

[phrunt]

I think it's best just to wait and see rather than presume we know what is inside the head of every African or potential prospector from around the World on which detectors they'd spend their money on.  You don't know until it's sitting there waiting for them to buy if they'll buy it or not.   If it suits their purpose at the right price for their wallet then it makes sense to give it a go.   

Their new detector appears by the photos of having a full carbon shaft so it's a possibility they're aiming for light weight, it sure looks light in the photo.  They just have to get the price/performance ratio correct and it should be a good seller.