Amazed At How Quickly White’s Discussion Faded

[KD8GIS]

 No you are making your point, (Selling detectors by any means). I don't use the old 5000D but made a point to it's ability's.  I believe your looking at detectors in the Prospecting terms.  I'm amused at your thinking.  A company only survives by bells and whistles. Take note of Ebay and Legacy detectors. Then again I focus on Civil war relics and coins of the same era. I couldn't tell you the last time I was in a park or school.  Having said that I see many comments from People with $1.000 dollar detectors at the local "Tot Lots" picking up modern coins. Whatever floats their boats. 

 White's was always in the top two or three manufactures... You may not know it, But at one time Bounty Hunter was right up there with the best of them.  They then wanted (at any cost) Wanted to sell more detectors (make-um cheap). Today I see expensive stuff made cheap. People make excuses it's the (High tech) so worth the money.  I'll stand by my reasons, White's wasn't a top of the line for nothing. 

 At Steve H, Throwing White's under the bus, discounting them, Kinda like saying a 1964 Mustang is not worthy. 

[KD8GIS]

AT Joe D... Monte, Yes that is sad, Always liked his input to the hobby.  (Joe) "Good or bad, everyone can make there own judgment, but most like the leading edge, and excitement of new machines.   (Me)  I can't see "The leading edge" being so far ahead, Light weight, I can see that as a big selling point.  Again my type of detecting (Relics and the era of very old coins) makes for different quality's/abilities desired. I'm sure there's many (Old time) detectorists who don't even look at the forums anymore. I just recently just started stopped by. Hey everyone, Thanks for the comments. 

[Joe D.]

    I don't know if Steve, or anyone else here, threw Whites under any busses! And you have some valid points! But besides the fact that he knows the business inside and out; he's a big boy, and if he feels the need to justify anything here on his forum, I'm sure he will!

   All I can say is keep it a clean fight!!???

    And thanks for some interesting conversation, I haven't posted this much in a while!!????

[KD8GIS]

Ya I probably over reacted to Steve's comments on White's.  Tough markets out there today, "New and Improved" has been a selling point for every product in the last 50 years. "The latest and greatist" Heard that one before. Again I'm old, Still know how to cook a great beef stew from scratch.  Can gut a deer and run a trotline as Hank would say. 

 I put a few videos up on "The youtube" over the last few years.  KD8GIS Bruce  is my channel.   OH yes the early 80's were a time... Pockets full, silver everywhere.  

[Steve Herschbach]

10 hours ago, KD8GIS said:

At Steve H, Throwing White's under the bus, discounting them, Kinda like saying a 1964 Mustang is not worthy. 

My comments had nothing to do with how well Whites detectors work, and I could care less what you choose to own. I’m not selling you on anything. It’s like I insulted your wife or something - get a grip. They are inanimate objects. My comments were about the future of the industry, and detectors made by a company that went out of business because it lost the thread of what most customers are looking for are not relevant to that future. I worked with Whites in many ways for very many years, and tried my best to get them to see reality before it was too late. Arrogant mismanagement ran a once great company into the ground, and I’m more unhappy about that than most.

[Joe D.]

   And there is the predicted response from Mr. Steve!?I must be psychic!!?‍♂️? 

    Now if only I could apply that psychic ability to my detecting, I would be posting a lot more!!??

   Life is way to short to sweat the small stuff KD8! On to bigger and better finds, with whatever you choose to swing!!???

[Jim in Idaho]

I think one of the things missed in the "reasons" for Whites going out of business is that Whites was a privately held company. The owner, and chief engineer was at, or beyond retirement age. Apparently he had no descendant able, or interested in running the company. I assume Ken White had been aware of all this long before the company closed, and stopped putting money into product development. I can completely understand that. He accomplished an enormous amount, and led the industry in new product ideas for decades. He just finally decided it was time. I refuse to look at this as a "failure" of any sort. I spent my entire life self-employed, and I understand this.

Jim

[cudamark]

On 5/2/2023 at 9:34 AM, KD8GIS said:

(PHRUNT)  "people using their 10 year old Whites detector doesn't keep a business alive"  Strange statement, sure it can be true, But when did you see "Quality" as a bad thing.  In My 40+ years I have updated to newer machines, Kept older machines.  I can say My first White's 5000D Series 2  1980 detector could run any day with todays' detectors.  XL Pro, MXT, Wonderful machines.  Bells and Whistles, Ah yes, When a person gets to know a machine often times most of those bells and whistles don't even get used.... Find the People who "Find the good stuff" What are they doing?  Well you will see a common usage. Low to no discrimination and a sensitivity setting as high as can be used.  Why should I give up what works great for me?  

I started detecting 53 years ago and was a big White's fan for many many years. That said, your statement that the 5000 (or 5900 or 6000di Pro for that matter) can "run any day with today's detectors" is only true if the targets are relatively shallow, the ground mild, and we're not talking wet salt water sand or ocean. Like the analogy of the '64 Mustang compared with today's vehicles.....sure the Mustang will get you the looks, and it may be fun to drive....at least in fair weather, and nobody stops suddenly in front of you, and you don't have to make emergency turns, and you don't mind the less reliability and extra maintenance, and you don't mind the poorer gas mileage, and the lesser performance, etc. Does that make the '64 Mustang a better overall car than a 2023 Mustang? Not hardly....in any area you wish to choose....except maybe looks! ? Would I still drive the '64? Sure, for fun, not as a daily driver or a trip where I wanted reliability, safety, and comfort. 

[phrunt]

2 hours ago, Jim in Idaho said:

I think one of the things missed in the "reasons" for Whites going out of business is that Whites was a privately held company. The owner, and chief engineer was at, or beyond retirement age. Apparently he had no descendant able, or interested in running the company.

Perhaps the Whites people should have considered Steve's method of gifting the company to the employees, and sat back and watched it thrive, nothing motivates an employee more than it being their business.  White's would still be alive and kicking, and they could have had stipulation that new employees coming in get a % of the business to encourage new engineering talents and so on.  I think it's a great way to make a business thrive when the original owner no longer needs or wants to be there on the front line although they can still maintain a % themselves and a position in the company more on the "outside"

A computer company I worked for in my early years did that, we had 5% each staff member, It worked well, people were always motivated and cared, and the company grew very quickly.  I moved on and donated my 5% back to them when I left, didn't bother taking it out.

My wife's work was similar although she was in the corporate world and she was given a large quantity of shares each year, as were the other employees there, similar thing I guess but sure kept staff thriving to meet goals to ensure they get their shares, the better they did the more shares they were given.

Without the boss telling people what to do perhaps Whites may have done better, the engineers having the freedom to do what they want to do.