Garrett Ace Apex Versus Minelab Vanquish 540

[Chase Goldman]

On 5/17/2020 at 1:10 AM, palzynski said:

Actually I prefer the 540 buttons ergonomy . There are more buttons on the 540 , 10 instead of 8 for the Apex , with more space between them. On the Vanquish I very frequently use the All Metal and the Backlight direct access buttons . What about this with the Apex ?  Do you have to go in the Menu to activate them ?  Could be a little complex …

Actually prefer the Apex in this regard.  Unlike the Vanquish and the Equinox for that matter which make you step through every mode in sequence, the Apex gives you +/- buttons to let you step through the modes in either direction so you are never more than two clicks away from zero mode.  Yes a dedicated AM/Zero mode button would be nice, but I plan on probably staying put in Zero mode most of the time anyway (and possibly setting up my "Custom" slot as zero mode too but with a specific frequency - if that is possible) which, unlike the Vanquish, I can do without having to set up notches on the low end to drown out ground noise due to the maddening fixed ground balance setup of the V.  Remember, the key on Apex is not the modes which are just different discrimination patterns but whether you are in Multi/Multi Salt or single frequency.  Really need to see what hoops you have to jump through to change frequency and MF modes before I render a final verdict on menu/display ergonomics. Looks like the MF/operating frequency display is overridden by Target ID.  That might be TAD confusing if you are in single frequency mode even with that little FREQ kHz off to the side. We'll have to see how they implemented it.

[Ridge Runner]

Chase  

 I’ll be glad when someone like you or Steve can get their hands on one. I do believe what’s said myself and others could take to the bank .

 I’ve got money burning a hole in my pocket and I need to find a detector to spend it on . I was never one that wanted to know how it worked but only it could do what they said . That’s all I want to know this time.

 Thanks for all of you smarter than I.

 Chuck 

[palzynski]

2 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

Actually prefer the Apex in this regard.  Unlike the Vanquish and the Equinox for that matter which make you step through every mode in sequence, the Apex gives you +/- buttons to let you step through the modes in either direction so you are never more than two clicks away from zero mode.  Yes a dedicated AM/Zero mode button would be nice, but I plan on probably staying put in Zero mode most of the time anyway (and possibly setting up my "Custom" slot as zero mode too but with a specific frequency - if that is possible) which, unlike the Vanquish, I can do without having to set up notches on the low end to drown out ground noise due to the maddening fixed ground balance setup of the V.  Remember, the key on Apex is not the modes which are just different discrimination patterns but whether you are in Multi/Multi Salt or single frequency.  Really need to see what hoops you have to jump through to change frequency and MF modes before I render a final verdict on menu/display ergonomics. Looks like the MF/operating frequency display is overridden by Target ID.  That might be TAD confusing if you are in single frequency mode even with that little FREQ kHz off to the side. We'll have to see how they implemented it.

 

I always use the Multi mode on my Equinox to benefit of the advantages of both high and low freq at the same time.. I very rarely use the single freq mode ..

Why do you use the monofreq on your Equinox ?  I am quite curious on this thanks .. 

Otherwise you are right we will have a better idea of the APex ergonomy after having tried it on the field  ..

BTW I have just looked the Garret Apex official video today . Very nice video , very clear , they have done a great job with this video. I like the Apex audio which looks to  be  more stable and silent between targets than the MLs Equinox and Vanquish . To be confirmed on the field ...

[Steve Herschbach]

2 hours ago, palzynski said:

Why do you use the monofreq on your Equinox ?  I am quite curious on this thanks

For me two reasons specifically. First, to eliminate or reduce electrical interference in some locations that MF cannot handle. Second, when gold prospecting there are some hot rocks that hit hard in multi that a single frequency will ignore.

I have not tried it yet but some users are reporting better results on silver coins using 5 kHz in some situations as regards 3D separation at depth.

I have a new theory about a another reason I would want to use single frequency but I have to test and prove it yet.

[EL NINO77]

Steve ... is this the so-called natural sensitivity of a certain frequency which works better for a given conductivity of an object?...

[Steve Herschbach]

3 minutes ago, EL NINO77 said:

Steve ... is this the so-called natural sensitivity of a certain frequency for a given conductivity of an object?

If you mean the idea I have I'll post about it sometime on another thread whenever I get around to it. It's more like the hot rock example- trying not to detect undesirable things rather than detecting desirable things. For me the single frequencies are more useful for what they do not detect than what they detect. Multi almost always detects better than single frequency, but sometimes that is too much of a good thing.

[palzynski]

1 hour ago, Steve Herschbach said:

For me two reasons specifically. First, to eliminate or reduce electrical interference in some locations that MF cannot handle. Second, when gold prospecting there are some hot rocks that hit hard in multi that a single frequency will ignore.

I have not tried it yet but some users are reporting better results on silver coins using 5 kHz in some situations as regards 3D separation at depth.

I have a new theory about a another reason I would want to use single frequency but I have to test and prove it yet.

Ok you use monofreq for gold prospecting and prevent EMI  . Btw on a big coin at 11inches depth on my test box I have noticed that the Equinox 5khz freq is a little better than Multi .  But I prefer to use the Equinox Multi on the field because I do not want to miss small targets like a small hammered coin even if I am rather looking for medium/big coins in a given area .

I am not a gold propector and usually few EMI where I go , so always on Multi . One of the reasons why I like the Vanquish because I do not really need this single freq feature ...

[EL NINO77]

... Yes .... in some cases ,, sometimes multifrequency means too much TX power in one place .... and also too much energy for RX Signal processing, but it is also related to that of some frequencies of multifrequency are more sensitive definitely terrain conditions ..... ,, .. especially it is visible on small coils ...

And... then the individual frequencies come into play ....

  Steve .... In any case, I will be very curious about your observations ,,, and I am glad that you also deal with such issues in detection ...Thank you for your reply...👍
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[Steve Herschbach]

34 minutes ago, palzynski said:

Ok you use monofreq for gold prospecting and prevent EMI  . Btw on a big coin at 11inches depth on my test box I have noticed that the Equinox 5khz freq is a little better than Multi .  But I prefer to use the Equinox Multi on the field because I do not want to miss small targets like a small hammered coin even if I am rather looking for medium/big coins in a given area .

I am not a gold propector and usually few EMI where I go , so always on Multi . One of the reasons why I like the Vanquish because I do not really need this single freq feature ...

You may not be a prospector, but if you ever run into rocks, brick, or coke that is really troubling you, do not forget the single frequency options. I’d rather have them and not need them, then not have them when I find I need them.

[Chase Goldman]

3 hours ago, palzynski said:

Why do you use the monofreq on your Equinox ?  I am quite curious on this thanks .. 

 

1 hour ago, Steve Herschbach said:

For me two reasons specifically. First, to eliminate or reduce electrical interference in some locations that MF cannot handle. Second, when gold prospecting there are some hot rocks that hit hard in multi that a single frequency will ignore.

I have not tried it yet but some users are reporting better results on silver coins using 5 kHz in some situations as regards 3D separation at depth.

I have a new theory about a another reason I would want to use single frequency but I have to test and prove it yet.

Pal,

Similar reasons as Steve - 

• As Steve says - there are situations where EMI dominates the MultiF modes and a single frequency option can often resolve this.
• In my case, relic hunting in thick iron and mineralized soils, I find that single frequency tends to perform better for me.  For one, it ensures I am hitting on a frequency reasonably optimal for the mid-conductive relics I seek (brass buttons and buckles and lead projectiles) and it it eliminates the low frequency components that tend to hit harder on buried iron targets.  Even though Equinox has single frequency options, I still tend to favor my Deus or Orx for relic hunting  because the Deus/Orx provides better audio modulation than Equinox (I do like to occasionally switch back and use Equinox Gold mode because of the VCO like audio).  MultiF as implemented on the Equinox does provide target ID at depth better than single Frequency in mineralized soils, but the advantage is marginal.  I bring both Equinox and Deus to my relic hunts.  Also have similar success on coke and coal in farm fields that were tended by steam engine tractors.
• I have found the main advantage of Multi F on a salt beach or when hunting in mild soil conditions without thick iron junk.
• Some users have reported that operating at 10 or 15 khz single helps with better IDing of non-ferrous junk like aluminum can slaw.

58 minutes ago, Steve Herschbach said:

For me the single frequencies are more useful for what they do not detect than what they detect.

This is a great quote and pretty much sums it up.