F19 Vs Gold Bug Pro

[phrunt]

I was always interested to see the differences with a new model 19kHz Fisher detector, they seem to slip in updates to firmware over time as they work things out, and do other changes to enhance performance and the 19kHz Fishers are really good detectors.

With my Gold Bug Pro's being quite old now, I wanted to compare them to a newer model and see if they had fixed the problems I knew about with mine, and thankfully they have.

My Bugs were bought when I first started detecting, I bought them at a Fisher stockist in Australia as NZ's dealer had no stock and went out of business shortly after, I did manage to get my GBP 10x5" Coil from him before he went down.

The trio

What I noticed immediately was the Gold Bug Pro's ran at 100% gain more stable than the F19, at first I was disappointed by this, especially when the larger Detech Ultimate 13" coil went on the F19 it was noticeable how much more unstable the detector was, 90% gain on the F19 was as stable as 100% gain on the GBP.  

This is the coil I noticed it most on, the smaller Nel snake both ran at 100% gain fine.

With a bit of further testing I've established the F19 has a higher overall gain than the GBP's, this gives increased target sensitivity and depth, so, as a prospecting machine the F19 (new model) is better than my Gold Bug Pro's (many years old models) 

When the GBP is running at 100% gain with the Nel Snake, the F19 with the same coil at 100% gain slightly betters its performance on tiny gold.

These were my test nuggets for comparison.

I also put it up against a much higher performance detector on small gold, the Gold Bug 2, while the audio on the GB2 is much louder on the targets, the F19 was able to give near equal performance as the nuggets were bigger, and the smaller ones the GB2 did better, but the difference wasn't as dramatic as I was expecting.  I retired my GBP's from prospecting detectors a long time ago, but it was a pleasant surprise to see they still do pretty well, especially with the Snake, it gave a significant boost over the Nel Sharpshooter (Cors Fortune) coil, and of course the 10x5" stock coil on small gold. 

The other problem I had with my Gold Bug Pro's was the 99% silver large coin wrap around to iron issue that the Gold Bug Pro had, I am not sure if they have fixed this in newer models but it was a problem on both of my Gold Bug Pros.

Here is a video of the problem I took when I first discovered it.

I was able to fix the problem with my Gold Bug Pro's by opening them up and adjusting a POT, I was careful when doing so, it was ever the slightest turn to get the silver wrap around to go away, I also tested using a ferrite and small lead targets to ensure they were falling into the right place before and after doing the adjustment.

Here is the same Bug once I'd adjusted the POT on a few different large silver coins.  Working well now.

I found this comment on a Youtube video about the F19 and silver coins by someone, they indicated Fisher had fixed up the silver coin problem on the F19, so I tested it out, and indeed it is fixed.

 

My UK 99% silver crown test coin now comes up in a good spot, this was with the same Snake coil.  I'm going to now re-tweak my GBP's so they come up the same numbers as the F19 by adjusting the POT again, as I'm sure Fisher worked out a better spot to put it than I have, mine was guess work, they would have the proper knowledge to adjust it correctly for best results.

Now the odd thing is when Fisher compare the two on their website they say this

They completely neglect that the F19 has better notching, a backlight, volume control and this new higher sensitivity than the Bug, at least the Bugs I have as the big differences between it and the Bug.

The other odd thing is in their specifications for it on their website they say it takes two AA batteries, buzzzz wrong! It takes a 9v.

Fisher really needs to get their act together, you can't even download the GBP or F19 manual from their website, dead links, and to give incorrect information about models is just wrong, how could they think it takes 2 AA batteries? Some bad cut and paste work going on no doubt.

So, as it stands, unless the GBP has improved since I bought mine someone would be crazy to pay for a GBP, especially if it still costs more like it historically has just for the name, as the F19 is significantly better, I think I may even start using it.

By the way, you can check your Bug firmware version by having it in disc mode, holding down the pinpoint/GG button when you fire it up, mine both come up version 4, and to check it on the F19 you hold down the pinpoint button while in disc mode when you turn it on, not the menu button, and my F19 is version 3.  I wish we could see a changelog of the firmware updates for both detectors.

[Gold Dust Ernie Jr]

I have better deep silver coin machines in my (DFX 300, MXT 300 and my TDI SL). 

If the GM 24K operated at 24K instead of 48K... well then I could just leave my GBP and F-19 in the truck and I'd be set and good to go.

Until the ground gets to hot and then I'd have to break out my TDI to keep going.

A gold focused metal detector that runs on a single 9V battery seems to me to be be like a toy... but in hotter soil maybe not so!

A relic machine running on 9 volts. (I don’t think so), but we shall see. (I haven't tried the GB P Deep coil yet so I can't say, but   my guess is it's gona be out powered and out gunned on Relics and deep silver by other older and the newer modern metal detectors.

(Like the Minelab Extera Pro, MXT 300, TDI SL, ect). 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[phrunt]

I just found discussion on the GBP firmware versions indicating what has changed between some versions on Dankowski detectors forum by our very own Steve, so I'm sure he won't mind me putting his post here.  The rest of the thread is also a very interesting read for those interested in the FT 19kHz machines.

"The late 1980s Fisher Gold Bug was a real design breakthrough at the time with S rod, elliptical coil, and compact detachable control box. It ran at 19 kHz which was high at the time. There was no discrimination at all. Just beep and dig. It is a very good detector but the lack of ferrous discrimination would be a major lack compared to the current crop of detectors.

The 1990s Gold Bug 2 looks physically the same, but upped the frequency to 71 kHz making this an extremely hot unit on tiny gold. The trade off is it actually gets less depth on large gold in mineralized soil than the earlier 1980s Gold Bug. The addition of a very good iron discrimination setting is a major plus, and the model is still produced today. As a prospector I consider it a "must have" detector due to the extreme sensitivity to small gold. The Gold Bug 2 can be purchased new with either a 5" x 10" concentric coil or 4" x 6" concentric coil for the same price. There are no DD coils for the unit. The only other coil option is a 14" elliptical coil.

First Texas then decided to produce a huge number of variants on a new design. The new 21st century Gold Bug is sold as the Gold Bug, the short lived Gold Bug Special Edition, the Gold Bug Pro, and to really make life interesting, the Teknetics G2. These are all 19 kHz detectors with digital target id and adjustable audio discrimination. The Fisher units have a S rod design with control box mounted on the rod and the Teknetics units have a pistol grip design with the control box mounted on top of the pistol grip. The Gold Bug Pro comes with a 5" round DD coil and the Gold Bug Pro DP is just another variant in that it is the same detector but standard with the 11" elliptical DD coil. The G2 comes with the 11" elliptical DD. Units with the 11" DD cost $50 more than units with the 5" DD.

The new Gold Bug, Gold Bug Special Edition, and Gold Bug Pro all also have firmware variants which generally change the audio output in small ways most people would not notice but which detector nerds like myself obsess over. Modulated audio or not? VCO or not? There was also some concern about lack of sensitivity to silver coins at one point supposedly addressed by later firmware variations. Regardless silver is not a strong point on the Gold Bugs which, well, are designed to find gold. I believe we are up to version 4 of the firmware, with version 3.0 and 2.9 Being a couple earlier versions. With the unit turned off and set in disc mode, depress the ground balance button. Keep holding it depressed, and turn on the detector. The firmware version should display. My Gold Bug Pro displays version 3.

If buying new I think you can pretty much ignore the firmware issue. If you like S rods, go Gold Bug, and decide which coil you want to get with it as the stock coil, 5" or 11" (or both). If you want pistol grip then go G2 but as far as I know you can only get that with the 11" coil as stock. Just to make matters interestingI will mention that the new 5" x10" DD accessory coil is getting nods as perhaps the best all around coil for the unit. Mine is on order so I will have to weigh in later on that. For prospecting I would lean towards getting the Gold Bug Pro with 5" coil and adding the 5" x 10" accessory coil if you want a larger coil.

Hope this helps,

Steve Herschbach"

So, there we go, I wonder if they ever went past version 4 on the Bug, if anyone has one that is a recent purchase it would be cool to see if you have a newer firmware than my version 4.

I assume the version 3 I have on my F19 is the latest, but with the F19 being a newer detector I'm surprised they're up to version 3 on it unless the Gold Bug is now up to version 6 or something.

I think the silver coin problem was fixed with a POT adjustment, not a firmware update, as demonstrated by my Gold Bug Pro's.  This seems to be verified by Keith in a post under Steve's on that forum.

I'm also wondering if Fisher wind down the sensitivity on detectors like the Bounty Hunter Time Ranger Pro so the more expensive models of the same detector perform better, this would be simple for them to do and encourage people to buy the higher priced models seeing they're the same detector, I would not be at all surprised.    So, if anyone has a Time Ranger Pro, please check the firmware version too, that might be interesting.  I am betting they do.  I guess the only way to know would be side by side testing like I've now done with my GBP's and F19 with the F19 having higher gain than my old model GBP's.  I think the Bounty Hunter will have a lower gain making it more suitable as a beginner's detector with the target brand and price range.

[Hard Prospector]

Great stuff phrunt and thanks for sharing.  BTW;  how do you suppose the Bounty Hunter Time Machine would compare to the F19 and GB Pro. After all,  same parent company right?

[GB_Amateur]

17 hours ago, phrunt said:

When the GBP is running at 100% gain with the Nel Snake, the F19 with the same coil at 100% gain slightly betters its performance on tiny gold.

One complaint of the Gold Bug Pro early on is that because you couldn't hear electronics noise when you maxed out the sensitivity (100%), that FT had intentionally limited it -- a kind of idiot proofing in the eyes of experienced users to minimize complaints from inexperienced users.  Thus one possibility is that for the later released F19, Fisher took that into account and gave it more umph.

Another possible explanation is that you just happened to get a hot unit.  (All speculation here.)

I'd be surprised if the Time Ranger Pro' sensitivity/gain is shackled even further.  Do you think your F19 is as sensitive as your Tek T2?  If not then the idea they intentionally kept the gain low so as not to interfere with high end detector sales (e.g. Fisher F75) doesn't really hold up.  (And yes, they run at different frequencies -- 13 kHz for the F75 and T2.)

I'll fire up my GB Pro later today and report on the large silver coin test.  (Done -- see next post.)

[GB_Amateur]

In an air test at max sensitivity, my GP Pro stock w/5"DD coil in Discriminate Mode (All Metal mode doesn't show digital target ID but rather ground balance setting) gave dTID readings in low 90's for USA 90% silver dollar, 1 ozt 99.9% silver round, and 1 ozt 99.9% silver rectangular bar.  I stacked those three on top of each other and it still read in the low-mid 90's.

That's one sweet detector that's so easy to set up.  It doesn't have quite the depth of the modern multifrequers, nor features like noise cancelling that many detectors have.  But for turn-on-and-go-find it's a workhorse, and the coil availability is also excellent.

[phrunt]

4 hours ago, GB_Amateur said:

I'd be surprised if the Time Ranger Pro' sensitivity/gain is shackled even further.  Do you think your F19 is as sensitive as your Tek T2?  If not then the idea they intentionally kept the gain low so as not to interfere with high end detector sales (e.g. Fisher F75) doesn't really hold up.  (And yes, they run at different frequencies -- 13 kHz for the F75 and T2.)

The T2 is a different detector entirely though, the Time Ranger Pro, GBP, F19, G2 etc are all the same detector, so it does make some sense they'd make the Bounty Hunter a little less sensitive being the cheaper model/brand.  It's also beneficial, as it's a brand targeting beginners so having it wound back a bit makes it even more stable and something a beginner appreciates.

I wish I had one now to compare just to see.  I would guess the new GBP's have their sensitivity wound up the same as the F19 has and the Time Ranger Pro has it's wound down a little bit.

Even a #9 lead pellet test the F19 is doing slightly better than my GBP with the same Snake coil on, and that's a pretty easy way to see the performance on tiny stuff.  I'd love to waive that #9 pellet over a Time Ranger Pro with the Snake on it.

Maybe, just maybe even though they do use the same model detector across various brands and price points, there is actually a difference between them when it comes to the gain at least.

It's good your Bug has the silver fix done on it, do you know what Firmware it has on it? And what year you bought it?   I'm guessing my Bugs were sitting in stock years at the dealer, and I did get them a good price at the time, but they were not a hot selling product it appears.  I bought two at once so my wife could use one, and got a deal for doing so.

[GB_Amateur]

2 hours ago, phrunt said:

...Do you know what Firmware it has on it? And what year you bought it?

When I turn it on (without holding down any buttons) it flashes "5 15 10 00 27".  I'm pretty sure the first two numbers are month and year of manufacture.  I bought it in August 2015.  Unfortunately my Ground Grab / Pinpoint button has developed a problem and is flaky (at best).  As such I can't do the firmware query as Steve outlined in his Dankowski forum post.

[Chacapamac]

Just buy a Gold Bug Pro (Build in July 20 2023)

In both Discriminate and All Metals metal identification numbers constantly around:

Gold: 68

Silver:  87

[Steve Herschbach]

On 5/5/2024 at 9:52 AM, Chacapamac said:

Just buy a Gold Bug Pro (Build in July 20 2023)

In both Discriminate and All Metals metal identification numbers constantly around:

Gold: 68

Silver:  87

Gold or silver what? The numbers for gold and silver vary with the object size. Gold in particular can read anywhere on the scale. Metal detectors actually know nothing about metal composition and rely mainly on conductivity and eddy current retention for identification purposes. Size is a big factor and in general on the disc scale small items read low and large items read high.