Mf Machines On Mineralized Black Sand Salt Beach. Update 4/8 Legend, Manticore, Nox 900.

[JCR]

The post above is a good example of how & why a True All Metal Motion channel would be very useful in certain conditions.  It is a shame that none of the more recent high end SMF introductions include this once common feature. It is already in the detector, just limited to Non Motion Pin Point. The Rutus Versa is the only example I know of that offers it as a user option.

[dave_e]

JCR,

This is one of the reasons I keep my Impact.  It has a couple different TRUE all metal modes. 

Not just turning off disc or "enabling the horeshoe".

[JCR]

@dave_e, yes I will keep my Anfibio Multi too for that & other reasons. And how about your Atrex?   But they are all Single frequency. In tough ground conditions, My SMF units run noticeably smoother & ID deeper. Why not True All Metal on more SMF machines?

[dave_e]

On 2/8/2024 at 10:25 PM, JCR said:

@dave_e, yes I will keep my Anfibio Multi too for that & other reasons. And how about your Atrex?   But they are all Single frequency. In tough ground conditions, My SMF units run noticeably smoother & ID deeper. Why not True All Metal on more SMF machines?

I was considering trading my Apex.  It's really gently used and is mint and has the tiny CC coil and the white 11" DD.

Thinking about trading the Equinox as well. 

My shoulder is telling me I have to use something like a Deus I or II.  Trying to avoid surgery.

[JCR]

If you are pleased with the Atrex's capabilities you might want to seriously look at the new Rutus Versa. It is very light weight & balanced in a modern waterproof package.  The modes & options mirror the Atrex, but the performance has been enhanced considerably. The upcoming software update will enhance it even more. I think a Deus I would be going backwards on performance.

[RIbeach_hunter]

Looking at the EQ 800 for another salt water beach machine. Have a Deus 1 but could never get used to it as a surfline detector. It does not handle salt and minerals [black sands]very well on the New England beaches that I hunt. 

I hunt mostly with an older CZ-20 which hunts deep as long as Bl. sands are not heavy.

Saw something in a previous post that the EQ 800 had some issues with finding targets after digging out of hole. Could be small pieces of ferrous wire or rusted nail that the machine has discriminated out when the halo is disrupted.

[midalake]

On 2/14/2024 at 9:28 AM, dave_e said:

Thinking about trading the Equinox as well. 

My shoulder is telling me I have to use something like a Deus I or II.  Trying to avoid surgery.

Working on Hip mounting my Equinox. Give me a week or two. Hopefully will be completed and tested.  😎

[midalake]

On 2/7/2024 at 11:46 AM, Bill (S. CA) said:

is to find settings that work for you and you are kind enough to share your results.  Gee, interesting concept, you know?  

So here it goes. Lots to unpack. [again]  Been testing for weeks. 

Settings Beach Sensitive 40KHZ max
Disc 6.8
Sensitivity 90-94
Salt sense 7
Iron vol 6
Reactivity 9"coil .5 13" coil 1.5-2
Audio resp. 6
Manual GB
FULL TONES offset 8
Bottle caps 2
Magnetic reject. 

The good:
Nonferrous targets clean-up better at depth and sound less clipped. 
The chatty noise level of the machine reduced/muted. 
Less iron wrap-around [much less] 
The Bad: 
Complete loss of detection with wave wash moving over coil.
Loss and difficulty of small target detection.
Lots of ground balancing required. 

I felt this mode of Full tones has really made some difference in making targets at depth sound better. I also credit manual GB for some of this as well. Testing showed tracking GB did make targets at depth sound a bit clippie. But is really the two put together, full tones and manual GB. 

While Magnetic reject helps some with Black Sand chatter, I fear it is a small item and maybe even chain killer. In trials for weeks this D2 package is nowhere near as sensitive as my Equinox on small targets.  I do not have a gold chain to test but have tested a few small bits.  

Full tones> Full tones gets the most credit for better sounding targets at depth. I feel using the offset is mandatory. The offset is what really makes the difference in the ability to tell the difference of Black sand ticks and deeper non-ferrous hits. 

Sensitivity, one of the issues I see with the D2. Increasing the sensitivity to look at one target can be difficult. The D2 has a tendency to enhance both iron wrap-around and deep nonferrous.  Whereas more sensitivity with the Equinox enhances deep nonferrous and will help ferrous break down more. 

With the complete inability to remove a target in the wave wash with the D2, I am heading back to the Equinox again and hope for my Black Sand conditions to lift some. Going to try hunting more in the wet sand with Black sand accept and see if this will result in better sounding small targets. Then switch to Reject with water contact.  Thank to Jeff for pushing me to try manual GB. Even though it is an entire PIA and time consuming.  
 

 

[JCR]

Glad you are making some advances in setting up for your tough site conditions. Do you think the tracking GB was helping on the wave wash at the expense of hurting on the Black sand?  The wash changes quickly,  the actual Ground slower?  Your in a hard fight with BS on one side & salt conductivity& small gold on the other.   Interesting that the smaller coils reactivity in slower than the larger coil. Just goes to show hunting conditions don’t always follow the text book.

[midalake]

10 hours ago, JCR said:

Glad you are making some advances in setting up for your tough site conditions. Do you think the tracking GB was helping on the wave wash at the expense of hurting on the Black sand?

My conditions change a little.  At no point this season has the D2 been great with recovery in the moving water. There was a short window where the 13" coil seemed to work [a little] in the wave wash. But it got rough again and the Black sand has increased lately. My general feeling right now is there does not seem to be an advantage in Tracking or Manual GB in the wave wash.  My manual GB numbers have ranged from 82-87.  I did experiment one day with going to a Dive program for recovery but that did not seem to solve much. Going to set-up a custom dive program to see if I can get recoveries made in the wave wash. 

10 hours ago, JCR said:

Your in a hard fight with BS on one side & salt conductivity& small gold on the other.   Interesting that the smaller coils reactivity in slower than the larger coil.

Not very comfortable with the 9" coil on the beach. It feels like I am out there with a teaspoon.  When the reactivity is above .5 the coil really shortens up audio response and swing speed becomes an issue.
I keep the reactivity low, so I get a broader response on targets, and I can maintain a decent swing speed. 
I have to do more testing with magnetic accept and reject. For almost two years I ran magnetic accept. Now with this new program on magnetic reject my fear is the machine is not responsive to small targets.  Both the Equinox and D2 would come home with their fair share of small bits. But now, the D2 rarely finds any. Two days ago, I had a smaller target that in my opinion should have had a much better response.