Mf Machines On Mineralized Black Sand Salt Beach. Update 4/8 Legend, Manticore, Nox 900.

[Chase Goldman]

23 hours ago, JCR said:

I don’t have Black sand on a beach, but l do have Maghemite relic sites that present a similar challenge. The minerals up average higher conductive targets around the scale into the ferrous zone where they will give a Ground/lron response. Mid conductor trash like pull tabs can come in as a Copper cent. @EL NINO77 really helped me out on overcoming this using the Hot Rock adjustment of the Versa shifted toward the Positive. I’m still experimenting with this, but it works to a noticeable degree. The MXT does this to some extent also by how the internal scaling is set. I think a Hot Rock adjustment would be beneficial on all high performance detectors.  Is there a setting on the D2 or Manticore that will influence the Target response in relation to the TID scale?   Magnetic Ground or Frequency addition modes?

To answer your question more directly, the Deus 2 has a Magnetic ground accept/reject toggle setting in the ground balance menu of the beach modes only but @midalake, if I recall correctly, finds it to not be very useful and it ends up, for him, severely limiting depth performance in reject mode.  I know that was the case pre-Version 2.0 Deus 2, not sure if he has fiddled with that setting since loading V2.0.  He’ll probably chime in to clarify that.

[EL NINO77]

6 hours ago, midalake said:

So in the picture is six targets from yesterday I did a reverse discrimination on. All nonferrous and were found in the Horseshoe mode on. All of the targets were giving negative numbers with a mixed positive number every once in a while. Due to their smooth single beep hits, I suspected these were nonferrous. 

When switching back to discrimination, all of the target responses were muted and broken with choppy sounds. Out of all of these it was my opinion that the small silver ring would have been the only target I may have dug if working only in Discrimination mode. The signals on the other targets were not repeatable and sounded like mineralization response. 
I have experienced this many times in the past. The Horseshoe Mode ALWAYS makes targets stand out more with better depth.  At least on a mineralized beach running Beach2. 

 

 

I thought of something like searching for targets in allmetal,,, but checking the found targets,,, as the next target check for discrimination 0/can also be set to 1 or 2 for an even better and more accurate ID.../

Clearly, the smoothness of the detection is significantly weaker - that's why it is not very suitable for normal detection..., but it can be useful for the next, more precise control of the VDI target...

 

[midalake]

17 hours ago, EL NINO77 said:

Clearly, the smoothness of the detection is significantly weaker - that's why it is not very suitable for normal detection..., but it can be useful for the next, more precise control of the VDI target...

Are these your tests? I am not familiar with any of the land programs. To me both tests seem similar.  It would be nice to see this test done in Beach2.  I can tell you my Black Sand is not that bad. 

In my real-life conditions here running Beach2, I NEVER see discrimination mode coming close to what Horseshoe mode can do.  In fact, I would never be able to run a land program here with the salt and black sand.  

[midalake]

5 hours ago, Chase Goldman said:

Magnetic ground accept/reject toggle setting in the ground balance menu of the beach modes only but @midalake, if I recall correctly, finds it to not be very useful and it ends up, for him, severely limiting depth performance in reject mode.  I know that was the case pre-Version 2.0 Deus 2, not sure if he has fiddled with that setting since loading V2.0.  He’ll probably chime in to clarify that.

I did not like how magnetic reject worked in the original .71.  I have not tried it in the update. Will swing the D2 on one day this week to verify any differences with 2.0 and fringe targets. 

[midalake]

On 1/13/2024 at 1:48 PM, JCR said:

Is there a setting on the D2 or Manticore that will influence the Target response in relation to the TID scale?   Magnetic Ground or Frequency addition modes?

Tested the 2.0 update today with my trusty "ring on a string" on Magnetic Accept/reject.

Ring placed Deep in wet sand with intermittent water contact. 

D2 in 91 senstivity, which is what I could comfortably hunt. In Beach Sensitive,  40Hz the D2 struggled where I placed it, could barely hear it.

First was Magnetic Accept!  Lousy sounding target, clipped and short in sound. Numbers were all over.

Second Magnetic Reject. Ditto>  Lousy sounding target, clipped and short in sound. Numbers were all over.

There was just no way to confirm this target. Went back and forth numerous times. I give a slight nod to Magnetic Accept. Target a littler cleaner and numbers were a smidge tighter.  However, I would have just walked by this target. The sounds were not much more than Black Sand interference. Important to note: Magnetic Reject did not have ANY value in adding sensitivity. Black Sand mineral response was only muted slightly, but still present. 

So, turned the D2 off and fired-up the Equinox. It has been a very long time since I have done any head to head.  Beach2, noise cancelled then hunted around and settled at 21 sensitivity where it was huntable.

Went back to the ring location and was surprised at the great response. Clearly would have stopped me for further inspection. At 21 there were mostly negative numbers, with a clean single beep response. An increase to 22, and the response was louder and single positive numbers started showing every third sweep. Would have no doubt dug this target. Pic of today's take.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JohnnyRox]

Enjoying this thread.  Why Beach 2 though and not 1?  

 

[midalake]

1 hour ago, JohnnyRox said:

Enjoying this thread.  Why Beach 2 though and not 1?  

 

I am in water contact with Black Sand. Beach 1 cannot handle those conditions. 

[RIbeach_hunter]

Thanks for the information on the D2 and 800!

 

[midalake]

Back out with the D2 yesterday and the 13" coil. 

After weeks of hunting the Equinox, was not impressed with switching back. Black sand is still tough here.

A couple of notes though. It seemed that raising the reactivity to 2 on the 13" actually helped clean-up some nonferrous targets at depth. This is something that is very hard to do with the 9" coil because an increase to 2 gives you very tight non-ferrous signals and one has to watch their swing speed. 

Still have issues with iron wrap-around with the new update. Did an experiment on what I figured was a Bobby Pin registering 52. 
I hunt with the Disc. at 22. So, I lowered the Disc to 0 in Beach Sensitive and re-swept the target. The target response was more robust and even confirmed more to dig it. After removing, it was a Bobby Pin. 

It seemed Disc of 0 was the lowest value for Beach Sensitive. Not sure why I could not adjust to -6.4.  ?

 

 

[Bill (S. CA)]

I've been following along with Midalakes post because I like his testing approach.  He just tries things and tests and then posts the results.  This particular test has really interested me since here in S. CA the Deus II just rules the beach.  Period.  Nothing out here can beat it in the wet sand, and that includes black sand.  I'm not speaking from testing results, just in the field results.  I'm pretty good with my 800 and head to head, on deep targets, even using Midalake's "double beep" method, the Deus II goes deeper.  

My friend, Frank, uses a Deus II exclusively and constantly whips all of us.  These are the settings that he uses in the black sand.  I have compared signals with him in heavy black sand and can't hit targets at depth that his Deus II hits hard.  He has found several small gold earrings of late using his Deus II that neither the Manticore of 800/900 could hit.    Perhaps you guys could try out his settings and see how you do.

Bill

P.S.  He uses the 11" and 13" coils.

 

I'm using beach sensitive
Discrimination  6.8
Sensitivity  93 to 97
Salt sensitivity  3
Frequency  40
Iron volume  6
Reactivity  1
Audio response 6
Tones.... full tones
Offset 5
Bottle caps 2
Notch off
Silencer 0