Another Ghost Nugget & Hoping The Gpx-6000 See's It

[Gerry in Idaho]

Great responses from everyone and I appreciate the love as I really do try and care about my customers Success and them knowing their detectors better than what any other dealer will provide.  I love it when I see other dealers offering education, as that is what separates us few from the majority.  So when I see them offer some training, I just make sure my staff and I offer more and also the knowledge of seeing different kinds of gold in its natural state the way it was found and how those varying pieces respond to the multiple gold detectors on the market is very informative and unknown to most, including many dealers.

As stated by some of my customers that have taken my class before, the density of the gold in a specimen is critical to how it responds to the different detector technologies.

Here is something to think about.  A Larger or dense nugget on the Minelab PI's/ZED in the preferred timings we use in most places of the US, the gold makes the low-high-low sound and pattern.  But smaller nuggets and the few specimens with dense enough gold in it that the PI's/7000 see, they make the traditional high low sound.  Now I realize there is always an exception, but 4 of my staff and I have been running Minelab PI's since the SD-2100 days for 20+ yrs.  Our ears have learned the pattern of sounds as well as the width of target response vs ground noise and we've all dug 1000's of nuggets to compare to the sounds of the gold we find.

Brian mentioned it.  How many people have taken a vial of flower gold 1/4 oz, 1/2 oz, 1 oz and listened to their PI detectors?  Most will crap their pants with the results.

Let's hope the extra sensitivity of the 6000 can help in recover more of those ghost nuggets so I can quite taking 2 detectors on my trips.

 

[Cascade Steven]

Thanks for sharing your knowledge and insight.

[cobill]

Latest OZ post from Jen Walsh on FB. The GPX 6000 is seeing reef gold, maybe it can find what Gerry is looking for!

Bill

[green]

Hi Gerry, interesting topic. I've been trying to make a PI detector detect #9 lead shot. Wondering how much harder your nuggets are to detect. Have you compared #9 lead shot with some of your nuggets? Maybe a single piece and another with 16 pieces on some masking tape folded over making a square 4x4 pieces? A piece of #9 lead shot has a time constant less than .7us, 16 pieces should have the same time constant with 16 times the signal.

[Glenn in CO]

Gerry,

Very interested in hearing your results on the GPX6000. The the type of wire specimen gold and some leaf gold specimens we find a PI detector will not pickup. Would love to have a PI detector that can detect our type of gold and provide additional depth compared to a VLF.

[GB_Amateur]

11 hours ago, green said:

A piece of #9 lead shot has a time constant less than .7us....

Do you mean 7 microseconds (instead of 0.7 microseconds)?

[Chet]

Hi Green

There are a few lead shot tests here;
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEN_BLb2wrHNkGzP3iDOJMw

Have a good day,
Chet

[green]

18 hours ago, Chet said:

Hi Green

There are a few lead shot tests here;
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEN_BLb2wrHNkGzP3iDOJMw

Have a good day,
Chet

Hi Chet

Thanks. Know wondering if a length of copper wire might be a better target to compare detectors.

For GB_Amateur, #9 lead shot is about .7us

[Chet]

Ghost Nuggets vs. Pulse Induction (PI) Detectors vs. Very Low Frequency (VLF) Detectors:

Disclaimer; some liberties have been taken in this write up to simplify a very technical subject into a simpler understanding of what is going on. 

Pulse Induction (PI) detectors transmit very sharp powerful pulses. At the end of each pulse the receiver is quickly turned on to receive a very weak signal from electrical currents that are still circulating but quickly dying out in the gold nugget.

The length of time that electrical currents continue to circulate is dependent on the conductivity and amount of conductive material and the shape of the object.

The overall design and timings of the transmitter and receiver and effective coil size determine whether the smallest nuggets or only the larger solid nuggets at depth will be detected.

Ghost nuggets contain small gold wires and/or small flakes of gold scattered in a quartz specimen which have very short periods of electrical current flow. In Green’s charts and wire table this short period of weak current flow is referred to as a Short Time Constant. 

Solid nuggets have long periods of electrical current flow (Long Time Constants) along with much greater signal strength which can be detected easier for a much longer period of time after the transmitter has turned off.

In Very Low Frequency (VLF) induction balanced detectors the transmitter and receiver are always on. When the null balance of the VLF coil is disturbed by a nugget the signal is processed to determine how much delay or phase shift in the signal has occurred.

The results of the phase shift evaluation is displayed as a ferrous or non-ferrous value. If the nugget is tiny the phase shift will be too small to give a reliable ferrous/non-ferrous display value. A dig anyway flag!

In the case of a Ghost Nugget the accumulated sum of all of the small wires/small flakes will give a good unbalance of the nulled VLF coil. And usually sufficient phase shift to indicate non-ferrous/gold.

So what Gerry and some of us are hoping is that the GPX 6000 improved design and processing will allow it to detect the very Short Time Constants of some of the Ghost Nuggets.

Have a good day,
Chet
 

[Gerry in Idaho]

9 hours ago, Chet said:

So what Gerry and some of us are hoping is that the GPX 6000 improved design and processing will allow it to detect the very Short Time Constants of some of the Ghost Nuggets.

Have a good day,
Chet
 

Chet,  Part of the training sessions my staff and I do with customers (you a few times in years past on a variety of detectors) is interact, teach, learn, give/get advise and overall camaraderie within that group for the 3 days.  I realized way back when on your 1st time with us, you had a gift as well and to this day you still display it.  Your knowledge of electronics in detectors is above me, as I just know how to operate them well, but not really knowing the finer points as of what is going on in in a detector.  Sure I know PI and VLF and patters, but your words of wisdom shines more light on it for us all.  

Even with all that power, you still enjoy comparing detectors, coils, settings, targets, just like my Staff and I...as the ultimate goal is for us to all get better.  I look forward to getting the GPX-6000 in your hands, meeting again some time in NV or maybe CA this go round (if I get an invite) and comparing all over again to get the best results we can.

This fine forum has some very knowledgeable followers and sharing bits of  MD'ing experiences, knowledge and tips is what helps strengthen the hobby and hopefully putting a little more gold in the newer prospectors hands.  New customers holding their 1st nugget and a golden smile is what my staff and I enjoy and I also feel you to are about sharing the knowledge we've earned and learned from yrs past.

 

You said it very well again Chet and thanks for the time/effort to add to the post.

Again, just like when my staff/I can snap a pic of a golden smile for a 1st nugget, you my friend shined on us again some of your knowledge in simple terms.

See you in the field this Summer/Fall, teaching-learning-smiling.