Minelab Fy23 Investor Presentation For 2024 - No GPZ 8000?

[jasong]

Theoretically, the big thing with ZVT was it's immunity to X soil components due to the lack of contamination from having to sample during long decay periods like with a PI. While simultaneously having much greater sensitivity for the same reasons - no pulse decay to muddy the waters, sampling at zero voltage instead, thus it can hear ultra fast transient targets (tiny gold). 

This should mean that technically the GPZ should vastly outperform the SDC in bad ground. And the 6000 should have no business being close to as sensitive as a good ZVT machine, which means the 7000 was at least semi subpar for a ZVT machine if a PI can match it. I expect improvements. 

The 8000 seems like it should improve greatly on both sensitivity as well as bad ground handling (well, X anyways, maybe not C/salt). I think many people are expecting far too little from whatever this next machine should be, because all this stuff shoulda been doable by 2017. Now we have a decade of EMI mitigation hardware/algo advancements, better coils, better ergonomics.

My expectations are high for this machine. If it ever shows up. I expect a machine that obsoletes the SDC, 6000 and 7000 entirely. 

[Skookum]

That's an impressive order.  If it lives up to the picture you painted, perhaps, it could be a machine to end the need for multiple. Although, if it is to be, it might cost more than multiple. I find it intriguing that if the future of ZVT is so good that it has not been produced in cheaper versions to appeal to the masses. Could a delay mean it’s a little harder to improve upon than expected?

[jasong]

10 hours ago, Skookum said:

Could a delay mean it’s a little harder to improve upon than expected?

Not sure if it's a bean counter thing or an engineering thing. There is nothing to do but speculate since Minelab remains so opaque about literally everything they do.

Based on their patents though, I suspect it's the former and not the latter, since the verbiage used in the 2023 patents seems to indicate exactly this - PI's should have no business being as sensitive or as good on X ground as ZVT machines. Yet, they seem to be competitive compared to the 7000, in the SDC's case it's handles X ground better I think while still being quite sensitive. So the logical conclusion to me would be a new ZVT machine improving measurably, at least in terms of ground handling. 

[Steve Herschbach]

14 hours ago, jasong said:

My expectations are high for this machine. If it ever shows up. I expect a machine that obsoletes the SDC, 6000 and 7000 entirely. 

Setup for disappointment if I ever saw one.

[jasong]

1 minute ago, Steve Herschbach said:

Setup for disappointment if I ever saw one.

Based on what?

[Steve Herschbach]

My opinion, which people can take or leave as they please. It's not like I know anything about the goings on in the industry, so don't mind me Jason, I'm sure you've got it nailed. 

[jasong]

Well alright then. Pardon my lack of industry connections in which to base my own opinions, I am of course limited to the public information the rest of us are limited to. I detailed the reasoning behind my opinion. But if the conversation is just "I know secret things" then I guess there isn't much to talk about is there?

While I may be disappointed if the 8000 doesn't meet my expectations, it's a minor thing. I have more fun looking at technical data available and thinking about what might be. But that's turned into no fun here with the sarcasm, so I'll move on.

[phrunt]

Minelab would never release a machine that makes every other machine they make obsolete, they want to make every detector they have viable for sale, so a new GPZ would be some improvement over the earlier one, yet it would never make the 6000 obsolete, or any other in the range detector they want to continue to sell.  They are more likely to do baby steps, they also don't want it to be the last detector they make, if they throw the farm at it, they'll have little left for the future.  I think this is probably the biggest reason we get baby steps with models.   They'll release as little as they can get away with to make a viable new model that people will want to buy.  I guess I'd do the same if I had no competition.

We all know that they were holding back the GPZ, it can go deeper than they allowed it to, it can be more sensitive to small gold than they allowed it to.  This paved way for an easy release of the 6000, as its far more sensitive than a standard GPZ.  I don't see ergonomics as technological advancements so by lightening it up and adding new Bluetooth version and so on, that's a given on a new model, as other industries have done the leg work for them there, it's the guts of the detector that needs to change for the better to perk my interest, not the body the brain sits in.   My 5000 doesn't weigh much more than my 6000, due to upgrading body parts.

The earlier GPX series could go deeper than they allowed it to with their Commander coils too, and can be far more sensitive than it can with their Commander coils, they just didn't lock detectors down in those days, nothing new going on there.

This new GPZ discussions been going on for years, I think it will go on for years yet before we see anything, if we do and when it does come out, it will focus on depth.

[schoolofhardNox]

1 hour ago, jasong said:

Well alright then. Pardon my lack of industry connections in which to base my own opinions, I am of course limited to the public information the rest of us are limited to. I detailed the reasoning behind my opinion. But if the conversation is just "I know secret things" then I guess there isn't much to talk about is there?

While I may be disappointed if the 8000 doesn't meet my expectations, it's a minor thing. I have more fun looking at technical data available and thinking about what might be. But that's turned into no fun here with the sarcasm, so I'll move on.

jasong, please don't take it personally. Everyone is so sensitive these days. All Steve said was that what you want is unrealistic. I don't have any inside information on anything 😄 but even without it, Minelab has demonstrated that their strategy is to give you just enough to peak your interest in their newest machine. I learned that lesson quite well when I  prematurely bit on the 6000, figuring it was going to be a better 5000. Maybe there will not be a 8000 that is better than the 7000, but different like the 5000 to the 6000. One thing seems evident to me and that is the detecting industry has only one way to go and that is to trickle what's left of new technology to us. Otherwise they will cease to exist. Right now they are tweaking of what's left to tweak. What else are they to do - give us a machine that can REALLY tell gold from iron from aluminum? It will never happen. That would be their death.

[abenson]

There's always room for improvement with every new detector model. But I agree, why would Minelab put out a metal detector that's going to obsolete every detector they've made up until now as well as anything they could produce in the future. Not going to happen. They're going to milk the technology a little at a time.

There's probably not a lot of big gold left deeper (2 feet plus) that won't take an open pit mine to get at. But there's still plenty of 3 gram and smaller stuff within 18" of the surface current metal detectors can't hear. If you don't believe that just take a few inches off the surface of a proven area and go over it again and see just how much that few inches opens up. Technology that can handle EMI, salt and minerals better will eventually allow deeper detection on smaller nuggets. Heck better handling of EMI on the 6000 would help drastically. Even being able to have control over the threshold on the 6000 would be an improvement. Minelab make me a 6000 with manual ground balance, threshold adjustment, a few more timings, iron reject option, and a standard DD coil I can run on any of the timings and I'll buy one. Oh yea put the Manticore cam lock shaft on it too and get rid of the twist lock system.